February 10, 2012

"My fiancee is pushing me away and I've lost hope"

Romeo_and_Juliet_with_Friar_Laurence_-_Henry_William_Bunbury.jpg
my advice can't be worse than his

Here is an Ask Metafilter question, and my reply.  Maybe it will do someone else some good.

If you've already read it there, skip to IV, for what I could not include there.




My fiancee and I (both 23) have been together for just over 5 years and living together for the past 3. There have been ups and downs during that time, including a month-long break up about 2 years ago, but I love her and want to spend the rest of my life with her. She had a rough childhood (alcoholic father who left) and I think that this is negatively affecting our relationship and her self-image.

I had a female best friend from high school, who I knew before I met my fiancée, but I have largely given up this relationship because my then-girlfriend was jealous. It was a slow and ugly process and since then my fiancée has thought that I could and should find someone better suited to me than she herself is. I have tried my best to quell her insecurities, but they have been around for most of our relationship.

I proposed about a year ago and she said yes. Things seemed to be going well, but a few months later there was a conflict between my fiancée and sister at a wedding planning convention. I wasn't there, but my sister was apparently late and then didn't stay for very long, which my fiancée and her mother took offence to. Since then there has been tension between my fiancée and sister. This is even more concerning for me, since both of my parents are deceased and my sister is the only immediate family that I have left.

This past September was a terrible month for my fiancée, as her father died and she was laid off from her job. I tried to be as emotionally supportive as I could, but she didn't lean on me as much as I would have expected.

Roughly 2 months ago she started saying that she didn't feel right wearing the ring that I gave her because the diamond that I used is from my mother's wedding ring, and my fiancée thinks that the diamond should stay in the family (sister). I talked to my sister about using the diamond before I got the ring made and she was ok with the plan and the way I see it, once we get married my fiancée will be in the family anyway.

About the same time she told me that she had started taking anti-depressants. She said that she had thought about suicide, but had no immediate plans to do it in the future. I encouraged her to see a therapist, but she only took the pills which were prescribed to her. My fiancée stopped wearing the ring two weeks ago and a few days later she said that she really doesn't want to live anymore and that she has been pushing me away intentionally. I found her a therapist myself this time, and made sure that she went. She said that the therapist was insightful, but it hasn't made her change her mind. She said that she doesn't really want to go again.

We've tried talking about this, but she is emotionally distant and insists that I find another girlfriend so that she can leave me and not be missed. Feeling confused and unsure about what to do, I asked her best friend if she knew what was going on with my fiancée. She told me that she didn't know that my fiancée was thinking about suicide but that she did know that she was having second thoughts about the wedding and that she was stressed out about money.

So here I am. I'm scare and confused. I've tried my best to show my fiancée that I love her and that she deserves to be loved, but she is pushing me away. I'm tired of struggling to keep this relationship going, but now I'm worried that she will hurt herself if we break up. She seems to want to continue our normal day-to-day routine and act like nothing is wrong, but I just can't play this charade.

Any thoughts about this situation are welcome. I'm looking for some outside perspective to help me figure out what to do next. Let me know if I've left out any important details. Thanks.




II.

Here's my reply:

No. Please take this in the spirit it is intended.

You make it sound like your fiancee is suicidal; that you may be the only thing keeping her alive. Most of the Mefites' responses are about her depression. Yet your subtitle is: "My fiancée is pushing me away and after years trying to make things work, I've lost most of my hope."

"This past September was a terrible month for my fiancée, as her father died and she was laid off from her job. I tried to be as emotionally supportive as I could, but she didn't lean on me as much as I would have expected."

Her father dies, and what your radar detects that is amiss is how she treats you.

Do you think you know her better than anyone?  I think you believe other people have more facts about her, but that you can interpret them better than anyone. That's unlikely, but even if it's true then this--

I asked her best friend if she knew what was going on with my fiancée. She told me that she didn't know that my fiancée was thinking about suicide but that she did know that she was having second thoughts about the wedding and that she was stressed out about money.

-- indicates that her best friend's view of the "facts" is that the problem is you/marriage, not suicide. But instead of considering what that might suggest, you move to:

So here I am. I'm scared and confused.


You wrote that you proposed "about a year ago." I wanted to get a sense of where your head was at around that time. Fair guess you got engaged in Feb 2011? At that time, you Asked Metafilter: "The Liberal Education ideal is ruining my life. Please help disabuse me of it."

It started with Mortimer J Adler and his 'How to Read a Book'. I bought it about two years ago, and shortly after that time I became fixated on the idea of getting a liberal education and reading the Great Books.

I also have a tendency to avoid my university studies to look for "something else", some other activity or field of knowledge which will bring satisfaction to my life. I'm not sure if this is strictly procrastination, or if its something more. I started with reading books from Adler's list and other similar lists on the internet... Then I rekindled my learning of French. I've given up on the idea of learning to play an instrument, but I feel like I ought to, and I occasionally browse the web for pianos and piano lessons.

This much I could handle reasonably well, but then I found the The Teaching Company and The Modern Scholar. ...I've downloaded most of the courses that I could find through torrents, and have since been listening to the lectures for an average of 20 hours each week for the past 7 months.

I also need to find a job as my savings have nearly run dry.

I'm guessing I have a combination of an inferiority complex, a habit of procrastination, and a tad of neuroticism thrown in for good measure.



Somewhere around this point you asked a woman, "honey, will you marry me?"

And this is worth asking: what does it mean when a college student turns to the Teaching Company for a liberal education?  College has failed you.  Demand your money back. But you didn't really want a liberal education, you wanted to be... smarter.

A month later you Asked: "How can I feel good about finding a job and starting a career?" Not how can you get a career-- how can you feel good about it?


I'm an economics major who doesn't know what the hell he is going to do for a career after graduating, and frankly doesn't feel qualified to do very much. I went into university thinking that I would try for medical school, but I was one of those kids in high school who got good grades without trying very hard, and my nearly non-existent study habits have left me with a C average, although even that has been slipping lately. Now that I'm nearing the end of my academic career, I'm starting to freak out about my career potential, and the related anxiety has me neglecting school work even further.

Last year in a labour economics class, my prof stated that first jobs after college correlate with lifetime earnings. This has also added to my worrying, and I have been putting off getting a much needed part time job (partly) because of it.

The future is indeed terrifyingly unknowable when you can't even focus on the present.


III.


I go through all this not to embarrass you or criticize you but to show you two things: your life around this time is marked by ambivalence, anxiety, uncertainty, yet you decide to get married. But of course it makes sense that you would try to lock down at least one aspect of your life. You chose marriage-- which is typically what girls do when they're looking to be taken care of, to be defined by someone else.  Right?

But what if she's as ambivalent as you about the future, but she wants something else (other than marriage) to lock down?  Now a marriage is one more burden of uncertainty she has to carry around with her.

The second thing all this shows you is what your words reveal: that you are intelligent, interested, eclectic, hungry-- AND you are very conflicted, ambivalent, and uncertain.  These aren't psychoanlayses, these are explicitly your words.  This is the message you want people to hear.   If I can see all this just from Metafilter posts alone, it is absolutely certain that your fiancee knows it. Maybe she senses that you're grasping on to her because she's an anchor, and she doesn't want to be an anchor, she needs an anchor.  Most women don't want to be responsible for their man's stability, and she sounds like she wants some attention all for herself, of her own. Maybe she doesn't want to be married, maybe she's depressed, maybe she...

...regardless of the reason, she needs to get help, a therapist, and you need to get focused and NOT a therapist. Your problem is not unique: too much freedom. If you were stupid you could plug into the system easy, one talent= one job.  But for you there are too many possibilities.

Your parents being deceased, being in college, being smart... that's the ether in which a naturally worried, "is this good enough?" young man finds himself. The mistake many with that problem make is thinking that the problem is "themselves" and they need more introspection, or more insight, or more "brain hacks." You need less of those things. What you need are goals with concrete steps that you force yourself to boringly take.

So I think your relationship will end, hopefully you'll both be strong enough and mature enough to do it without drama and the stickiness that accompanies furtive attempts at breaking up (this is your third time?) I'm sorry for you, these things are inconsolably painful for a while. But whatever happens, your future happiness is entirely related to your ability to impose your own limits on your freedom. The time has come to not be everything you want to be, but to be one thing you've wanted to be.

I may as well tell you that once you've chosen a specific goal, and begin to legitimately work towards it, you may then find a different path suits you better; but that kind of insight is only possible after activity, after doing. Less thinking, more doing.

Good luck. I hope it works out well for you.



IV.

That was what I posted at that time.

But what I did not put in that post, the thing that I deliberately withheld because I didn't want it to get lost in all the other words; because it is the most important thing, and the thing most likely to be denied--  is that this guy chose that girl on purpose, for the purpose of maintaining his ambivalent world so no concrete decisions need to be made.   Concrete=loss of potentialities= no thanks.   Math and graduating is very forward looking; it's much easier to say, "can't study now, my girlfriend needs me, she's in pain."  I'd bet it makes him feel like a good person, too, all that sacrifice, just for her. 

I doubt very much if he truly believed she was going to say yes.  Her friends didn't think she'd say yes, apparently.  The point was not really to get married, the point was to create a dramatic event upon which to focus energy and thus delay any kind of physical forward motion.  By engaging in conflict that is impossible to resolve.

This is why I say he chose her to get rejected; to get jealous; to get sad over; to obsess over.  And then to recruit the rest of his world into this problem.  Nothing matters more than ego integrity; nothing matters more than the status quo.  Do you see? 

All of that is unconscious, and as soon as I say that word a specific group of people goes bananas.  No one likes to think they're not in control of their own lives, that they're saddled with an Abusive Boyfriend that wants nothing to change; but if they are in control, why are they anxious all the time?  Why so little progress despite resources, opportunities, and freedom?  If they're in control of their own lives, why do they all dress alike?

If you're in control, why do these relationships happen to you?  Isn't it more likely you chose them?

Others/the same people will take issue with my derision of introspection, because they believe it to be a Socratic ideal.   I'm not against introspection, I am against masturbation.  I'm against edging.  The critic wants to be able to contemplate, to go to therapy and discuss and introspect and what he will do there is talk about himself, think about himself, identify patterns in his life, things that have held him back-- and nothing will change.  So then he will tell me that he has "a really good therapist, she really pushes me!" 

The therapy becomes an elaborate narcissistic defense, the promise and appearance of progress while protecting an at best artificial and at worst non-existent identity.  "I want to learn why I am this way."  Then what?  Will learning why you made those choices be what changes your choices?  You're still eating junk food, aren't you?  You're eating it while you're learning  how bad it is. 

"But... why am I this way?"  That question is a narcissistic defense.  It doesn't want an answer, it wants you to keep asking the question. 

"I'm a good person, I just am making bad choices."  Wrong.  You're not a good person until you make good choices.  Until then you are chaos.

And you know it.



----

 http://twitter.com/thelastpsych







Comments

This is fantastic. Thank yo... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 12:17 PM | Posted by Guy Fox: | Reply

This is fantastic. Thank you. The original post was great, and tying it into the abusive boyfriend backs the advice up really well. Here's the simple and obvious question that is still confusing as hell:

If you focus on what *you*'re doing the whole time, it just becomes your movie, and everyone else just becomes some stock character or other, and it's unfair to them. They suffer, and you're miserable. So you focus on others, those in your blast radius, and everything feels better because it has meaning. You aren't just living for your own glory. But sometimes focusing on others is apparently, and plausibly, just a mechanism to distract you from the sh!t *you* need to do. You can help others by committing to your own path and moving forward on that. But then you wind up where you started. There might be a really obvious answer, but how do you know when to focus on your stuff and when to focus on what those around you need?

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Put this one in your book! ... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 12:22 PM | Posted by maha: | Reply

Put this one in your book! It's refreshing how straightforward it is.

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YES. Asking the question al... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 12:38 PM | Posted by Aaron: | Reply

YES. Asking the question allows you to convince yourself you're sorting out your problems, but not accepting any answer allows you to never actually sort out your problems.

But sometimes it goes further: when an answer cannot be avoided or denied, it becomes "ugh, this is how I am! Damn how I am!" and it continues.

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So true, Alone. I'm on the ... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 12:43 PM | Posted by Cecília: | Reply

So true, Alone. I'm on the verge of tears. Thank you for that!

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I want desperately make a g... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 12:52 PM | Posted by ?: | Reply

I want desperately make a good choice. I want to DO something. I have no idea where to start.

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"But... why am I this wa... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 1:11 PM | Posted by Carlier: | Reply

"But... why am I this way?" That question is a narcissistic defense. It doesn't want an answer, it wants you to keep asking the question.

The whole post is good, but this is fantastic. For a lot of people, learning that they have, e.g., a problem with commitment is a lot like learning that they're an INFP or Capricorn. It doesn't actually tell them anything useful or applicable; it only provides them with an excuse for perpetuating their behavior. "It's who I am." Yes, and thinking like that, it's who you'll be.

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Thank you very much for thi... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 1:17 PM | Posted by A Fan: | Reply

Thank you very much for this. :)

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As usual, the analysis is o... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 1:19 PM | Posted by Anna: | Reply

As usual, the analysis is off the heezy, but what's truly admirable is what you left out—in your own words because it was the most important thing and most likely to get denied. Even at its most critical, your writing always emanates compassion, not contempt. Thanks for giving us young 'uns a shake.

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Why do I find artifacts of ... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 1:27 PM | Posted by anon: | Reply

Why do I find artifacts of myself in so many posts? Why do I keep coming back to this site and reading more?

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Because reality as we all k... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 1:43 PM | Posted, in reply to anon's comment, by Z. Constantine: | Reply

Because reality as we all know it is an elaborate ruse to stave off any resolution to the conflicts established in our inchoate minds as infants (hey, beats being an animal... maybe) - also, because "if you're reading it, it's for you"

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God damn nigga I thought I ... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 1:49 PM | Posted by JayZ: | Reply

God damn nigga I thought I had 99 problems but they ain't shit.

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"reality as we all know it"... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 1:52 PM | Posted, in reply to Z. Constantine's comment, by anon: | Reply

"reality as we all know it" - There's a problem: I know what I think of as reality, but I'm not sure I understand it "as we all know it". What does that mean?

"if you're reading it, it's for you" - that's what scares me!!!!

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Thank you.... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 1:59 PM | Posted by Anonymous: | Reply

Thank you.

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Common phrase in 12-step pa... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 2:06 PM | Posted by Anonymous: | Reply

Common phrase in 12-step parlance: "Self-knowledge availed us nothing."

Self-knowledge - therapy - is like making a map. You can get a lay of the land - see where things are, where there are mountains and lakes and "Here There Be Dragons" and unexplored territories. And a good map/therapist can get extremely detailed.

But reading the map is not the same as traveling. Reading a map doesn't tell you what it's really like to scour for a pass through the mountains, or lash together a raft to cross the lake, or survive visceral confrontations with fear, or the joy and thrill of discovering New Things. You can only do that by undertaking the journey yourself. Take the map with you. Make changes.

Self-knowledge can give you an idea of your shortcomings, flaws, etc. But it's not an excuse (at least, it should not be), and it's not a substitute for action.

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"I know what I think of as ... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 2:11 PM | Posted, in reply to anon's comment, by Z. Constantine: | Reply

"I know what I think of as reality, but I'm not sure I understand it "as we all know it". What does that mean?"

Do you have an identity? (ego-death being the unlikely alternative)

Do you read things that remind you of yourself here?

"Do you see?"

(intone Ralph Fiennes' voice from Red Dragon for that last question - pretty sure that's what was going on in the post, too...)

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Might as well wire you 20 b... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 2:24 PM | Posted by nwt: | Reply

Might as well wire you 20 bucks for that

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Pure brilliance. ... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 2:26 PM | Posted by YOHAMI: | Reply

Pure brilliance.

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"Your problem is not unique... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 2:30 PM | Posted by Anonymous: | Reply

"Your problem is not unique: too much freedom." BOOM! "...your future happiness is entirely related to your ability to impose your own limits on your freedom." As well of all of part IV...so good. thank you

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"Your problem is not unique... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 2:30 PM | Posted by Anonymous: | Reply

"Your problem is not unique: too much freedom." BOOM! "...your future happiness is entirely related to your ability to impose your own limits on your freedom." As well of all of part IV...so good. thank you

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This is excellent.... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 2:55 PM | Posted by BHE: | Reply

This is excellent.

If I'm reading this right, it all boils down to this: if you want things to be different, YOU need to be different. But if there's anything human beings hate, it's changing themselves. And so the complicated system of narcissistic defenses, choices and identities we create to maintain, as you say, the status quo.

Knowing this doesn't make changing any easier, but it's the first step. As the saying goes, be the change you want to see in the world.

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Lines right on the spot:</p... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 3:02 PM | Posted by Wendy: | Reply

Lines right on the spot:

"The mistake many with that problem make is thinking that the problem is "themselves" and they need more introspection, or more insight, or more "brain hacks." You need less of those things. What you need are goals with concrete steps that you force yourself to boringly take."

"The critic wants to be able to contemplate, to go to therapy and discuss and introspect and what he will do there is talk about himself, think about himself, identify patterns in his life, things that have held him back-- and nothing will change."

I don't know if it's one of the silent epidemics: the squander of one's time and life, simply because. If you're from money, alright, you do have freedom to run yourself in perpetual circles (what a waste, but heck the life is yours!) The problem is when people who can't afford to think this way (where's the money gonna come from for this expensive habit?) pretend that they do.

Long time reader, first time poster. Your analyses of narcissism always provide food for thought! I read, I become self-aware, and try to mind that internal theater. We are all trying!

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I have some slightly differ... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 3:45 PM | Posted by Southern Man: | Reply

I have some slightly different advice for this young man.

(a) Not married yet? Good. Break it off immediately. You're a hopeless beta and no marriage of yours will ever last.

(b) Take the Red Pill. Start with the archives at http://roissy.wordpress.com. Read EVERYTHING. Then read the blogs of the regulars there.

(c) If after doing so you still want to wed this young lady, re-kindle the relationship but this time on your terms, not hers.

(d) You can thank me later.

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Oops, that URL is <a href="... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 3:47 PM | Posted by Southern Man: | Reply

Oops, that URL is http://heartiste.wordpress.com/.

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"Most of the Mefites' respo... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 3:56 PM | Posted by anonymous: | Reply

"Most of the Mefites' responses are about her depression." I think they should be! The young woman described in the question is in a state of pain and stasis about everything—money, therapy, her own worth—not just about her impending marriage. To me, her problems sound more serious than feeling "ambivalent... about the future" and reluctant to be someone's anchor.

I strongly agree that "she needs to get help," and thank goodness this post includes that amid all the talk about how the questioner can mold himself into a superman.

Our questioner: eclectic, uncertain, allegedly bright (he torrents Teaching Company courses!), allegedly destined for great things. I'm worried readers are having so much fun seeing themselves in him that the fiance who's a potential danger to herself gets almost totally forgotten.

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Bro, it's easy to miss beca... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 4:51 PM | Posted, in reply to Southern Man's comment, by Dudebro: | Reply

Bro, it's easy to miss because TLP barely ever talks about it, but it turns out that he thinks narcissism is a problem in our society.

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But none of this was really... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 5:01 PM | Posted, in reply to anonymous's comment, by Jane Shepard: | Reply

But none of this was really about her, was it? The hopeless guy's post wasn't, not really. It mentioned her, sure, but it was about him. And TLP's post isn't about her either. She wasn't the one with the question and she isn't the one likely to read the answer.

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"You're a hopeless beta and... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 5:41 PM | Posted by jeanne: | Reply

"You're a hopeless beta and no marriage of yours will ever last."

Yes it did strike me that he was terribly needy and dependent..and in some kind of negative feedback loop with the "fiancee." I was in something like that when I was 20, and thank god I was rescued by a deus ex machina (a great job in another state) and could say goodbye to all that.

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I clicked. Then I lol'd. ... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 5:47 PM | Posted, in reply to Southern Man's comment, by IFinishMyThoughts: | Reply

I clicked. Then I lol'd. The guy says:

"You are ROAMING all over, taking her on an adventure. In this world, there is no need to finish thoughts or draw conclusions. There is only need to EXPERIENCE. You’re grabbing her hand and running with her down an infinite, labyrinthine alleyway with no end, laughing and letting your fingers glide on the cobblestone walls along the way."

You were being ironic when you posted you advice, right? I totally didn't catch that at first. Good job.

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Roissy: "The authors have ... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 6:15 PM | Posted, in reply to Southern Man's comment, by HP: | Reply

Roissy: "The authors have deleted this blog."

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I also clicked, and then al... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 7:01 PM | Posted by HP: | Reply

I also clicked, and then also lol'd.

Unsure if serious.

I think it may be an entire blog built on trolling all the men of the internet.

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PS: Agreed - include this ... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 7:22 PM | Posted by HP: | Reply

PS: Agreed - include this one (with attached "Abusive Boyfriend") in any book endeavors.

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That's some good psychiatry... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 10:32 PM | Posted by John: | Reply

That's some good psychiatry, there.

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Old Liberian saying: "When ... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 10:39 PM | Posted, in reply to ?'s comment, by John: | Reply

Old Liberian saying: "When you don't know which way to jump, just start jumping and figure it out as you go along."

There are those of us who exist in the "you can be anything" generation, who are smart as hell. And so anything we do feels like "less than our potential" - yeah I've married a beautiful woman, but I could be bangin' supermodels! Yeah I've got a solid career, but I could be a millionaire! Or a doctor! Or a professor! Our probability assessment in the cost-benefit analysis is all screwy- we think that we'll succeed at all those things, if we just abandon this and go for them. But that's against all evidence about what's really happening: what's really happening is we're dicking around waiting for this life to happen to us, and while we do we're wondering why everyone ELSE is getting laid.

They're getting laid, and promoted, and paid, because they're actually doing things. We need to catch up. It doesn't matter which way you jump, just DO SOMETHING.

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The comment after yours say... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 10:42 PM | Posted by John: | Reply

The comment after yours says "Why not a therapist? Therapists can be great help with goal setting." I feel like if you need help with goal setting that you are a hopeless failure.

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How does one know at the... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2012 11:00 PM | Posted by Lauri: | Reply

How does one know at the time whether one is making good choices? I ask that in all seriousness. The Abusive Boyfriend post leads me to think that changing the status quo = good choice and maintaining the status quo = bad choice. It can't be that simple though . . . can it? Is your unconscious always the enemy?

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After reading the letter, I... (Below threshold)

February 11, 2012 3:36 AM | Posted by Anonymous: | Reply

After reading the letter, I expected you to destroy him. You showed some real heart with that one.

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I would love to know what y... (Below threshold)

February 11, 2012 5:52 AM | Posted by Anon: | Reply

I would love to know what you would make of this:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2012/feb/10/internet-dating-dangers-margaret-overton

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I want desperately make ... (Below threshold)

February 11, 2012 6:47 AM | Posted by fraula: | Reply

I want desperately make a good choice. I want to DO something. I have no idea where to start.

How does one know at the time whether one is making good choices?

IANAP or T (therapist), just someone who's been through this. You make good choices by starting with responsibility for your feelings and choices. What struck me most in excerpts TLP took from this guy's past were how he does not own up to much of anything. He even externalizes responsibility to a blurry other: "I feel like I ought to".

Start by recognizing that there is no other and there is no ought when it comes to your life (apart from obvious things like not harming people and honoring consent).

Does he want to do his studies? He mentions them in the context of someone else's ideas: "liberal education" and "great books". "Liberal" and "great" are adjectives, which mean they're opinions, which mean they're based on feelings.

This guy is substituting other people's feelings for his own.

I'm rambling around this central point in the hopes that it helps clarify: in order to make good choices, get to know your feelings, and then take responsibility for your choices.

Making choices based on what brings you joy, gives you a foundation from which you can make others. Priorities become clearer as you get to know yourself better, by honoring your feelings. Appreciation and compassion for others also opens up: you become less cut-off from your own feelings, which means you're better able to identify and empathize with others'.

All that is really what Joseph Campbell meant when he said "follow your bliss". He would use his career as an example, but people messed up when they then interpreted him as meaning that your career had to be your bliss. It doesn't. His statement is a lot more subtle and important than that: to follow your bliss, you have to be able to identify your feelings, respect them, and accept that your bliss is your choice – you are the one following it. Not anyone else. Later Campbell complained about narcissistic interpretations and said he wished he'd used the words, "follow your blisters."

When you follow what you love, you get blisters because it brings you such fulfillment that you don't care about blisters. It's hard work. Fulfilling hard work.

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I've gone through the oppos... (Below threshold)

February 11, 2012 7:29 AM | Posted by Coleridge: | Reply

I've gone through the opposite case. She wasn't my fiancee, but my girlfriend, and she was deeply and thoroughly committed to everything that she did. In fact, she could only work that way. We had been dating for a week and she suggested we wear rings. She cooked for me every day. She wanted me to spend my whole time with her. Naturally, it was overwhelming. Naturally, I broke up. She liked esoteric things, like astrology and feng-shui (at the time, I did too) and later she went back to school (she had a law degree already) to take a degree in psychology. She had a fiance. She jumped out of the window of her father's apartment, which is on the tenth floor. Up to now, I think she did it because she believed no one was as committed as she was, and she no longer could take the frustration.

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But if the guy a hopeless b... (Below threshold)

February 11, 2012 8:04 AM | Posted, in reply to Southern Man's comment, by Anonymous: | Reply

But if the guy a hopeless beta how reading this blog would help?

Go back and read Alone's post again, it's for you.

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wow, idiots recommending he... (Below threshold)

February 11, 2012 9:59 AM | Posted by grandinquisitor: | Reply

wow, idiots recommending heartiste as reading material for this young man... roissy and his cabal are seriously fucked up people, probably more in need of help than the fellow in question

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Ya, freedom is like money a... (Below threshold)

February 11, 2012 10:05 AM | Posted by Daver: | Reply

Ya, freedom is like money and time, its only value is in what you get through spending it.

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How awesome is this post!?!... (Below threshold)

February 11, 2012 10:16 AM | Posted by Paula: | Reply

How awesome is this post!?! I wish my abusive ex had a psychotherapist who could see his narcissistic ramblings as you were able to see this douche bag's. My ex sought counseling after I left him the first time due to his inability to empathize with me after a miscarriage. He thought the entire issue was my fault, that I must have been drinking secretly or not eating or doing something that would have caused the pregnancy to end early. He couldn't just see it as something that just happened and move on. He had zero control of my body and basically hated it. His therapist, of course, did not hear this. She only heard, "Why doesn't she love me the way I want her to love me? Why doesn't she do this or that or that or this?" Hell, because I am my own person with my own thoughts, feelings, and ideas!!! He was so good at projecting his BS onto me. I kept going back because I wanted to fix him. I wanted him to see that love has many facets, good and bad, and people grow through them...or they don't. He didn't really understand love, in my opinion.

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Longtime reader but I've ne... (Below threshold)

February 11, 2012 12:43 PM | Posted by wiggingout: | Reply

Longtime reader but I've never understood: Does TLP reply to any of these comments? Sometimes it appears people are addressing him in the comments as "Alone", but i'm never sure. It makes it hard to understand if there's a back and forth going on here. Anyone?


great post. I think it's great because it's about me. I see myself all over it. And I assume this means I'm a complete narcissist, which I'm finally beginning to understand a little. I always thought it was just everyone else but me.

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So, you finally came out an... (Below threshold)

February 11, 2012 2:35 PM | Posted by XON: | Reply

So, you finally came out and said it.

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One of the best articles I'... (Below threshold)

February 11, 2012 6:14 PM | Posted by Medusa: | Reply

One of the best articles I've read here. Truly excellent.

"But... why am I this way?" That question is a narcissistic defense.

I've gone very very very far down the introspective "why?" rabbit hole more than once in my life, but at a certain point it's like travelling between two parallel lines — you see the lines merge just up ahead, you are almost there, almost at the end, almost at the answer, oh so close. But that's merely a trick of perspective — you are forever approaching, but never arriving.

That train will never be able to travel at the speed of light. It is indeed quixotically narcissistic to believe that it ever will.

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I think it's great becau... (Below threshold)

February 11, 2012 9:02 PM | Posted, in reply to wiggingout's comment, by HP: | Reply

I think it's great because it's about me. I see myself all over it. And I assume this means I'm a complete narcissist, which I'm finally beginning to understand a little.

So...what are you going to do about it now?

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In general, with narcissism... (Below threshold)

February 11, 2012 9:18 PM | Posted by Anonymous: | Reply

In general, with narcissism, is the goal to let go of identity and simply "do" and be present and aware of those around you and your true feelings, etc.?

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OMG the roissy/heartiste ni... (Below threshold)

February 11, 2012 9:58 PM | Posted by Richard: | Reply

OMG the roissy/heartiste nihilistic fucks are already doing their rounds here. Bunch of whiny pussies disguised as "alpha males" who spend their free time bragging about imaginary conquests/love life on the internet. Excuse my French, but there's no other way to describe that lot.

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This is GREAT. My heart is ... (Below threshold)

February 11, 2012 10:49 PM | Posted by Wyatt: | Reply

This is GREAT. My heart is pounding. every one of your articles says something about my own condition. it's like reading Nietzsche. Write a book.

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Yes.... (Below threshold)

February 12, 2012 12:08 AM | Posted, in reply to Anonymous's comment, by Anonymous: | Reply

Yes.

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I think it's great because ... (Below threshold)

February 12, 2012 1:02 AM | Posted, in reply to HP's comment, by Anonymous: | Reply

I think it's great because it's about me. I see myself all over it. And I assume this means I'm a complete narcissist, which I'm finally beginning to understand a little.

So...what are you going to do about it now?

fake it till i make it, right?

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Longtime reader but I've... (Below threshold)

February 12, 2012 4:28 AM | Posted, in reply to wiggingout's comment, by Carlier: | Reply

Longtime reader but I've never understood: Does TLP reply to any of these comments? Sometimes it appears people are addressing him in the comments as "Alone", but i'm never sure. It makes it hard to understand if there's a back and forth going on here. Anyone?

"Alone" = TLP, yes. It's his username on the blog, and how he used to show up in the comments, back when he commented. He hasn't actually posted in the comments for a while, at least not that I've noticed, though based on his posts he does read the threads. (This may not be obvious unless you've been reading along, but e.g. in section IV here, that isn't just a rebuke against the general public or what he imagines his audience to believe; that is a response to things people in his comments section had been flipping out about.)

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> Old Liberian saying: "Whe... (Below threshold)

February 12, 2012 6:20 AM | Posted by Electric Soul Wish: | Reply

> Old Liberian saying: "When you don't know which way to jump, just start jumping and figure it out as you go along."

Christians, too: "God can't steer a parked car."

You know why? Because you can't imagine how you'll feel about something until you're halfway into it. That's true for me, and common for everyone, I understand. Imagination is one thing, dragging your whole self into it gives you a deeper response.

Jungians would label this whole situation as the problem of the Puer Eternus. Their solution is the same - work; climbing down out of infinite possibility.

I approve of this post (sure, you care!) For once your extrication of narcissism isn't dubiously twisty.

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We are a not-for-profit edu... (Below threshold)

February 12, 2012 9:59 AM | Posted by Max Weismann: | Reply

We are a not-for-profit educational organization, founded by Mortimer Adler and we have recently made an exciting discovery--three years after writing the wonderfully expanded third edition of How to Read a Book, Mortimer Adler and Charles Van Doren made a series of thirteen 14-minute videos--lively discussing the art of reading. The videos were produced by Encyclopaedia Britannica. For reasons unknown, sometime after their original publication, these videos were lost.

Three hours with Mortimer Adler and Charles Van Doren, lively discussing the art of reading, on one DVD. A must for libraries and classroom teaching the art of reading.

I cannot exaggerate how instructive these programs are--we are so sure that you will agree, if you are not completely satisfied, we will refund your donation.

Please go here to see a clip and learn more:

http://www.thegreatideas.org/HowToReadABook.htm

ISBN: 978-1-61535-311-8

Thank you,

Max Weismann

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Thank you for this text.<br... (Below threshold)

February 12, 2012 11:28 AM | Posted by Eipa: | Reply

Thank you for this text.
Funny enough that even setting goals, like work on ones liberal education (and then work on it more than 2 hours a day during 7 months), can be a strategy to escape from the duty of making decisions.

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Thank you.This post ... (Below threshold)

February 12, 2012 1:06 PM | Posted by Ryan: | Reply

Thank you.
This post is absolutely fantastic, and I suspect your response will be extremely helpful to the original questioner. This one needs to go in the book, next to Abusive Boyfriend.

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Paula,You were in ... (Below threshold)

February 13, 2012 1:42 AM | Posted, in reply to Paula's comment, by Quick: | Reply

Paula,

You were in a long term relationship and having a child with a man who you describe as abusive, narcissistic, and lacking the ability to empathize? I wonder how he hid this all until after the miscarriage. At least you left him for good after he revealed his true character, and then did nothing but go to a useless therapist who couldn't even diagnose him as well as you could. Wait... you went back to him?

Out of curiosity, would you have accepted anything from his therapist that didn't place the blame 100% on him? It's almost like you think the therapists role is simply to be a 2nd opinion for your own diagnosis. "Yep, you're broken." Also, were there any circumstances under which his dissatisfaction with the way you loved him or did things would cause you to adjust, or were you just always sure you were providing exactly the kind of love he needed and wanted, whether he knew it or not? Do you see any conflict with feeling so defensive about adapting to please your significant other, yet feeling so strongly that it was your role to change him into your vision of perfection?

You only went back because you wanted to fix him? How selfless of you. I think that I also don't understand what love is, can you please explain it to me?

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Oh, hell no! I believed the... (Below threshold)

February 13, 2012 7:59 AM | Posted by Paula: | Reply

Oh, hell no! I believed there was something wrong with me for the majority of the relationship. His projections and criticisms made me seek a therapist. (BTW, I don't have a child with the guy.) What is love? Love is instinctively caring for someone just because you want to care for someone. Not wanting anything in return. So, when he would say he loved me, I would get confused when he'd turn around and try to tell ME how to love him. "If you loved me, you'd stop writing your blog or delete your FB account or move in with me tomorrow or stop spending free time volunteering." I saw this as his insecurities and always thought, "Maybe I am being selfish." Sure, sometimes i was but, I was becoming selfless, more and more. I hoped to change him by convincing him that love comes with zero conditions and that having my own mind and opinions apart from his did not mean I didn't love him. He sought control in everything. Love is free and boundless, not restrictive and stagnant. :)

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While Roissy's "political" ... (Below threshold)

February 13, 2012 11:34 AM | Posted by DrModern: | Reply

While Roissy's "political" "thought" is confused, self-serving nonsense, I have to confess that I find little fault with his model of the dating market, and I see no reason to doubt that he is successful at picking up women. His attempts to communicate the useful portion of his knowledge about interacting with women have caused him to construct a narcissistic worldview around that (for example, as far as I can tell, Roissy has never encountered any studies that don't "validate game"), but this is hardly surprising.

That aside, at minimum, Roissy models the realities that govern mate-selection accurately and provides a compelling explanation for why relations between the sexes are structured as they are. He also provides advice that single men may find useful in their attempts to attract women. There's a lot of noise on his blog, but there's a kernel of truth.

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So to clear this up, identi... (Below threshold)

February 13, 2012 1:22 PM | Posted by DGS: | Reply

So to clear this up, identity is formed via actions and then a response?

I am talking about an authentic one - what is the cure for people who grew up without much of an identity and hence are reading this stuff?

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Exactly, imagination is one... (Below threshold)

February 13, 2012 1:25 PM | Posted, in reply to Electric Soul Wish's comment, by DGS: | Reply

Exactly, imagination is one powerful thing for some... but it can't QUITE be the real thing and sometimes it is VASTLY different from what you imagined.


and, as businessmen will tell you, it will usually take twice as long as twice as much.. aka it is HARDER in real life than you imagined, and hence, anxiety and not being sure if you match up.

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"I'm against edging." ... (Below threshold)

February 13, 2012 3:20 PM | Posted by Morrigan: | Reply

"I'm against edging."

Confused by this, can anyone elaborate please?

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he lost his children too an... (Below threshold)

February 13, 2012 3:42 PM | Posted, in reply to Paula's comment, by Anonymous: | Reply

he lost his children too and that may have been his way to cope... have you thought about that? It must have been shocking for him too

Also you spent so much time with him, was carrying his baby, and you can now only think about how bad he was? Also if he was so bad why are you still thinking about him and dissing him on an the internet?

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re roissy: of course he has... (Below threshold)

February 13, 2012 3:47 PM | Posted by Anonymous: | Reply

re roissy: of course he has character traits that must be off-putting to many and he clearly has an agenda or desire to see the world a certain way, but I think many of his observations are interesting and he offers a good model to predict human sexual behavior.

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I'm not dissing HIM. If I w... (Below threshold)

February 13, 2012 5:17 PM | Posted by Paula: | Reply

I'm not dissing HIM. If I were dissing HIM, I'd spell out the douche Bag's name. He withheld information about his STD because he's an evil mofo. He deserves no mercy and he sure as hell doesn't deserve sympathy for losing an unborn child that he threatened to steal from me if I ever chose to leave him, which he manifested from his fears not from any threats on my part. I hope you're entertained by all of this. It's the least I can offer. :)

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'"I'm a good person, I just... (Below threshold)

February 13, 2012 7:57 PM | Posted by Anonymous: | Reply

'"I'm a good person, I just am making bad choices." Wrong. You're not a good person until you make good choices. Until then you are chaos.

And you know it.'

I think you sound like a good person so far. You lost your parents but continued on with life, which must have been terribly difficult, you got a degree and are preparing yourself for the future like a responsible adult, and you are only 23. You've had what sounds like a stable long term relationship. (It sounds over, but still, it counts for something). I'm old enough to be your mother and if I was I'd be pleased.

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" 'But... why am I this way... (Below threshold)

February 13, 2012 10:07 PM | Posted by Pa: | Reply

" 'But... why am I this way?' That question is a narcissistic defense.  It doesn't want an answer, it wants you to keep asking the question. "

Yes, yes, that is so true! Less thinking, more doing. Excellent advice.

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'Even at its most critical,... (Below threshold)

February 14, 2012 2:37 AM | Posted, in reply to Anna's comment, by katydid: | Reply

'Even at its most critical, your writing always emanates compassion, not contempt.'
*gives me that she-only-read-the-cliffsnotes-, and wrote accordingly*feeling
'Thanks for giving us young 'uns a shake'
-oh, come on. but then again, maybe what i'd expect from someone who uses terms such as 'young 'uns'.

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Masturbating, but holding b... (Below threshold)

February 14, 2012 2:52 AM | Posted, in reply to Morrigan's comment, by Anonymous: | Reply

Masturbating, but holding back from finishing.
A common trick in pornography, used between takes to increase the volume of the 'money shot'.

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It is true that asking why ... (Below threshold)

February 14, 2012 5:50 AM | Posted by Caroline: | Reply

It is true that asking why wont necessarily help you change. Not because finding the reasons is not helpful (if I find the reason my program doesn't work, the precise line where there's something wrong, I can fix it), but because you don't really want to change and the 'soul searching' is an excuse. I am just repeating what you said.. Having struggled with OCD like thought patterns in the past, I believe I was asking 'why' as an excuse to avoid moving on, because moving on was too painful.

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jeez, quick. get off her sh... (Below threshold)

February 14, 2012 6:14 AM | Posted, in reply to Quick's comment, by katy: | Reply

jeez, quick. get off her shit and worry about your own superior attitude and what is lurking behind it.
on the lighter side though, you sound like a wannabe alone! alone's own little mini-me! except, you are downright mean.

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Re: Everyone worrying about... (Below threshold)

February 14, 2012 6:47 AM | Posted by marguerite: | Reply

Re: Everyone worrying about their 'narcissism' and trying to become so much better. My grandma always said theres nothing worse than a reformed *anything.* Sometimes acceptance and laughter can be best.

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And why is it so painful?</... (Below threshold)

February 14, 2012 2:00 PM | Posted, in reply to Caroline's comment, by ddd: | Reply

And why is it so painful?

Because you realize you have to compete with others and you might not be as good as them?

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Great comment, please answe... (Below threshold)

February 14, 2012 2:08 PM | Posted, in reply to John's comment, by DGS: | Reply

Great comment, please answer this:

If people are getting ahead, why do they arrive to middle management and divorce?


Because I don't want to arrive THERE. That's why I am afraid to start on any of these other paths other than the "cool ones"

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re: Roissy and pickup in ge... (Below threshold)

February 14, 2012 5:54 PM | Posted by Jay: | Reply

re: Roissy and pickup in general: It seems pretty clear that that bag of tricks can, in the right circumstances, get you laid. And, as a man, I agree that there's a lot to be said for that. But that approach relies so heavily on manipulation that real intimacy can't develop. When you get sick of trolling bars for girls with daddy issues, those patterns of behavior will only make it harder to find someone worth committing to. Intimacy can't happen until she sees the real you, and pickup is all about obfuscating that.

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was kind of clueless about ... (Below threshold)

February 14, 2012 6:57 PM | Posted by stacy: | Reply

was kind of clueless about where all this roissy comments were coming from (how did it become relevant to this thread?)(I half-read it; it sounds so stupid I can't believe theres anyone on this site who takes it seriously at all). roissy referring to the story of o, i guessed (hello, any literary pervs out there?-I guess not). the site's really dumb, but I kind of love it anyway, because it proves, conclusively and once and for all, that men are absolutely the same as women deep down and just as stupid. I mean, these guys are the same as chicks staring at the telephone! hilarious. except they have more of a sexual focus, but still. and to the poster above who doth protest his enlightened approach to intimacy, what's so bad about 'girls with daddy issues'? Do YOU even know what you meant by that, or did it just sound cool? and what does such a woman act like (a man?)(a lesbian?)(myra breckinridge?)-I'll admit I don't know, but I will say a big part of intimacy is having fun with the 'issues'-not annihilating them. (I don't know anyone who has P.C. sex). (Not even certain Republican fundamentalist Christians and absolutely no shrink I've ever er, 'been intimate with', I swear). How did you come to understand so much of the feminine psyche, anyway (Roissy)? (Just to be clear in case you don't get it, that last sentence is kinda sarcastic-I don't actually believe you know a ton about Oedipal issues).

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I've never seen so many par... (Below threshold)

February 14, 2012 9:09 PM | Posted, in reply to stacy's comment, by Hugh: | Reply

I've never seen so many parenthetical asides in my life, and that is not hyperbole.

As for blogs, I think Ramit Sethi's would be the place to start for a directionless 20-something. That is his target market, and I think he delivers the goods. His advice is always geared towards taking action, failure be damned, which is key (and probably the best takeaway from any good pickup artist blog, to boot (I can overuse parentheses at times myself)).

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This is why I say he cho... (Below threshold)

February 14, 2012 9:14 PM | Posted by Anon: | Reply

This is why I say he chose her to get rejected; to get jealous; to get sad over; to obsess over. And then to recruit the rest of his world into this problem. Nothing matters more than ego integrity; nothing matters more than the status quo. Do you see?

Yes. I do see. I had to get pretty high to do it but this is exactly right - what narcissist like myself will do is rather change EVERYONE's opinion than flirt with the chance that I am not fully confident in my life and choices - that may be I am not special, and that may be, like the song goes "Walk out, and at the worst, you'll see that nobody cares"

that's the problem for me - I have had people care for me for so long I don't know where to start doing it for myself.

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The substation of acting on... (Below threshold)

February 15, 2012 6:27 AM | Posted by Eddy: | Reply

The substation of acting on the fruits of introspection (its purported goal) with introspection as a means to suspend action.

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The substitution of acting ... (Below threshold)

February 15, 2012 6:28 AM | Posted by Eddy: | Reply

The substitution of acting on the fruits of introspection with introspection as a means to suspend action.

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dear Stacy: I'm not a psyc... (Below threshold)

February 15, 2012 9:22 AM | Posted, in reply to stacy's comment, by Jay: | Reply

dear Stacy: I'm not a psychiatrist, but when it comes to Daddy issues I know what I need to know. Some young ladies, and you shall know them by the clothing that's uncommonly provocative for the occasion, want male attention a little too badly. They're easy to pick up and hard to put down. Clingy, in a word. In more words, a deep-seated fear of abandonment that makes them hard to live with.

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Whitney Houston died from... (Below threshold)

February 15, 2012 5:31 PM | Posted by Harry Horton: | Reply

Whitney Houston died from drug related circumstances at the time of the Grammy awards in near mid February 2012. Anti depressants were a central drug type that was implicated for her death, as the L.A coroners department have assessed. Probably in combination with alcohol and other medications. 48 prescription drugs were found in her possession or premises at the time of her death. Thus the Hollywood drug saturation environs rears its ugly head upwards once again, with echoes of Michael jackson, Heath Ledger, amongst others---more recently the escalating drug taking by Demi Moore with her troubled state of mind, all echoes trailing off in the distance around and with Mrs. Houstons passing at 49 years. Demi Moore is 49 years old ironically when her life is going out of control with the dangerous drugs, same age and time WHitney Houston was experiening problems with drugs. Doctors are being placed under subponea in the Whitney Houston case as to the issue why so many drugs in her possession at the time of death. An interesting development as the week goes along.

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Also...she has directly sta... (Below threshold)

February 16, 2012 3:57 PM | Posted by Ozgur: | Reply

Also...she has directly stated that she doesn't want to get married and that she's not happy. Why is he still trying to convince her? And why would he want to? It's very masturbatory already--what she wants, who she is, and how happy she is are immaterial to him.

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This is a kind sentiment, b... (Below threshold)

February 17, 2012 12:50 PM | Posted, in reply to Anonymous's comment, by Asha Catari: | Reply

This is a kind sentiment, but I think it misses the whole point of TLP's reply to this guy's question. Getting a degree and preparing for the future aren't the same thing at all. Society/the media/convention tells us that they are, but in most cases that is a lie. Yeah, the guy is in school, or was. And yeah, he is reading and probably learning things. But the point is that it is all intellectual masturbation if he lacks any concrete goal. It is a way to fill time and get the illusion of 'doing something' without actually making a choice and you know...doing something.

As for the relationship, there is no correlation between length and stability.

I don't think the section you quoted was saying this guy is *bad*. Just that he isn't good because he hasn't earned 'good'. So, he is neutral, maybe?

I meant what I said about your comment being a nice, which is ordinarily a good thing. But in this case, it just sounds kind of like the lies the guy must tell himself in order to stay right where he is.

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Great post TLP. The everyda... (Below threshold)

February 19, 2012 7:06 AM | Posted by Rookie: | Reply

Great post TLP. The everyday full of potential, achiever of nothing narcissist is much more frightening than the stereotypical smiling narcissist executive in a suit. For a start he's far more familiar.

I'd quote the cliche line 'you make me want to be a better man' but I feel that would be missing the point. Your words encourage me to act better.

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balance, common sense, intu... (Below threshold)

February 19, 2012 2:43 PM | Posted, in reply to Guy Fox's comment, by Franc: | Reply

balance, common sense, intuition (with a grain of salt)

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Just curious, but what was ... (Below threshold)

February 19, 2012 2:50 PM | Posted, in reply to Jay's comment, by stacy: | Reply

Just curious, but what was going through your head when you used to pick up these chicks? Were you thinking about exploiting their instabilities and figuring it was fair enough since they wanted sex and were over the age of consent? I'm not trying to humiliate you here, I am literally curious.
It is so weird- I've dated a lot and thought I'd seen it all, but I have never in my life dated anyone who I thought was consciously exploiting my weaknesses, or at least, I'm sure I didn't go out with him more than once. It almost feels like Christmas inside my head, here: wow! a gift! a mistake I *didn't* make!

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Just curious, but ... (Below threshold)

February 19, 2012 6:47 PM | Posted, in reply to stacy's comment, by Anonymous: | Reply

Just curious, but what was going through your head when you used to pick up these chicks? Were you thinking about exploiting their instabilities and figuring it was fair enough since they wanted sex and were over the age of consent?

While their intent is sex, their motive is validation.
"These women think I'm awesome, so I must actually be awesome!"

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Personally, I'm a big fan o... (Below threshold)

February 19, 2012 9:02 PM | Posted by Helianthus: | Reply

Personally, I'm a big fan of masturbation.

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to Stacy: Please understan... (Below threshold)

February 20, 2012 9:44 AM | Posted, in reply to stacy's comment, by Anonymous: | Reply

to Stacy: Please understand that at the time I was young and naive. At first I was thinking "She looks hot. I should talk to her.". A couple years later, the same girl would make me think "She looks hot, but she has that look that makes me think we'd get along great for two weeks and be screaming at each other in a month." A few years later I was reading a book and thought "Oh, that's what was going on there."

One thing I've learned about manipulation, though, is that if it's pitched right to the individual, it can be remarkably blatant without being seen through. Third parties can see it easily, though. Have you ever had a coworker who just flattered the boss relentlessly? You could see it for what it is, but even when the flattery is laid on so thick as to seem sarcastic, your boss never questioned it, did he? Most bosses are a bit insecure, and flattery makes them comfortable.

My advice here is to trust your friends and family. If they think somebody's manipulating you, he probably is.

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Anon said: [i]what narcissi... (Below threshold)

February 20, 2012 11:17 AM | Posted, in reply to Anon's comment, by standswithagist: | Reply

Anon said: [i]what narcissist like myself will do is rather change EVERYONE's opinion than flirt with the chance that I am not fully confident in my life and choices - that maybe I am not special, and that maybe, like the song goes "Walk out, and at the worst, you'll see that nobody cares"

that's the problem for me - I have had people care for me for so long I don't know where to start doing it for myself.[/i]

Perhaps you could start by not caring what people think of you. If your worth is based on other's valuing of you, you are not worth much. Also, start valuing yourself for the good you do. If you do no good, start. And then the self-worth will follow. Take on a challenge, fail at it, start again, do better, fail a bit more, and keep on going. With that, comes mastery and true self-worth.

And yes, I'm talking to myself here, too...

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It is so weird-... (Below threshold)

February 20, 2012 11:30 AM | Posted, in reply to stacy's comment, by standswithagist: | Reply

It is so weird- I've dated a lot and thought I'd seen it all, but I have never in my life dated anyone who I thought was consciously exploiting my weaknesses, or at least, I'm sure I didn't go out with him more than once. It almost feels like Christmas inside my head, here: wow! a gift! a mistake I *didn't* make!

As a reformed "girl with Daddy issues" (GDI) I have mostly dated men who consciously exploited my weakness, which as Jay and anonymous insightfully pointed out is neediness for attention/validation, which then leads you open to doing anything to get your partner to stay. As my therapist pointed out, there are some people (not just men) who are like vultures and can smell "prey" a mile away. I had to learn to stop being such easy pickings...

Stacy, I'm really glad for you that you had the self-esteem to walk away from that type of romantic partner. I'm getting there, so wish me luck.

[Yay, I figured out the html, was using forum tags in my other post, sorry!]

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WOW. I am so impressed with... (Below threshold)

February 20, 2012 12:01 PM | Posted by stacy: | Reply

WOW. I am so impressed with the responses! Its gutsy to get on the internet and share things like that. So, thanks.
In the interest of full disclosure, I have some problems with closeness as far as zoning out when things are a little intense....if its sexually intense I'm OK...but dealing with other peoples anger or sometimes love/emotional intimacy, well, that is hard. For me.

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Do you guys ever wonder if ... (Below threshold)

February 20, 2012 1:28 PM | Posted by Anonymous: | Reply

Do you guys ever wonder if all of this is TLP's narcissistic defense (ex: projection, establishing self as an authority and identifying his problems in others as a way of trying to fix himself, trying to establish narcissism as a social pathology to feel less guilty or ashamed about his own shortcomings)?

Or is that my narcissistic defense that I wonder that all of this is TLP's narcissistic defense?

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to Stacy: That sounds comp... (Below threshold)

February 20, 2012 3:48 PM | Posted, in reply to stacy's comment, by Jay: | Reply

to Stacy: That sounds completely normal. Building a relationship means gradually opening up to the other person, and being opened up to. Each step leaves somebody feeling vulnerable, and both people can't help judging each other. And one person usually wants to go faster and farther than the other. There's a certain amount of awkwardness that can't be avoided. That's not to say that you don't have some particular issues, you almost certainly do. But having some difficulty with intimacy is normal. And if your date's anger was easy to deal with, you would be dating wimps.

to standswithagist: Sounds like you're on the right path.

P.S. I wrote the comment at 9:44 Feb 20, I just forgot to put my name in.

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He wrote a post about shrin... (Below threshold)

February 20, 2012 4:06 PM | Posted, in reply to Anonymous's comment, by ginnygeneva@gmail.com: | Reply

He wrote a post about shrinks who become shrinks in order to work their own shit out. I would guess if he does that he'd figure it out. Although if you are a shrink and don't find your job "fixing" you in some way (any work should lead to *some* growth) you might want to get out. I don't think he's trying to establish himself as an authority. If he wanted that, there are easier ways to get it, without having to deal with 500,000 people commenting on it publicly. Also the fact that people who post by computer are usually...not as polite and conscientious as people who have to physically *appear* in a public forum. He's leaving himself kind of open in a way. Also, if he were after power, the nature of his posts would be different, because he would be trying to not leave himself open to criticism. There are also *many* other people who have been bickering about "narcissism as a social pathology" for a long time; he doesn't have to do it at all if he doesn't *want* to. (Although someone needs to tell me how it is he has discussed it as "social pathology" and not personal pathology, because I don't see it). But do me a big favor if you would: what is your conception of narcissism? Often people use it very seriously on this forum in such a way that suggests they are pretty confident about what it is or means. I have my own thoughts on the subject... but I just don't *exactly* understand what it is the people on the site intend when they say it...and, also, I have no clue about Alone's sense of guilt or lack thereof. I can't even guess.

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Right..to not think of what... (Below threshold)

February 20, 2012 5:29 PM | Posted, in reply to standswithagist's comment, by Anon: | Reply

Right..to not think of what people think of me - thats the tricky part


point and action - i can go on a full dancefloor, dance by myself, and close my eyes and keep dancing... a lot of people cant

is this because I don't care what people think? No. It is me projecting the image of a guy who doesnt care and enjoys the music (I do) but which is it then?

I think we all care what people SEE us as. What they THINK of us is different, and may be needs not be as important?

I'd love more input on this as it is a struggle..

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<a href="http://thelastpsyc... (Below threshold)

February 20, 2012 5:38 PM | Posted, in reply to ginnygeneva@gmail.com's comment, by Eipa: | Reply

http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2010/11/a_generational_pathology.html

I think mainly he refers to narcissim as the lack of the ability to love (anyone including oneself).

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it is one thing to care abo... (Below threshold)

February 20, 2012 8:45 PM | Posted, in reply to Anon's comment, by ginnygeneva@gmail.com: | Reply

it is one thing to care about what others think/see you as, and another to let it stop you. also, it is one thing to care what others think, etc and not deal with it, and another to deal with it (talk to them, argue, walk away) with them, or to care but not even do anything about it with yourself (pray, write, rant at the walls, read a self-help, etc book)

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You are super totally aweso... (Below threshold)

February 20, 2012 9:02 PM | Posted, in reply to Eipa's comment, by ginnygeneva@gmail.com: | Reply

You are super totally awesome. Thanks---I read it, he does talk about narcissism as a social phenomenon.

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I have insomnia. I've been ... (Below threshold)

February 21, 2012 1:04 AM | Posted, in reply to ginnygeneva@gmail.com's comment, by ginnygeneva@gmail.com: | Reply

I have insomnia. I've been lying there thinking about my not-so-great advice. (Which wasn't really advice, just a list of options).
I don't usually try to help with this topic, but I might as well try.
Lookit: I spent one week in the hospital, and while I was there I was on the psych unit with a pathological narcissist. The dude was HORRIBLE. You would not have to know the signs of narcissistic personality disorder to know there was something SERIOUSLY wrong with him. It was obvious he had mental problems-really really obvious.
I can't recall ever having a serious problem on a psych unit (My diagnosis is MDD) with another patient that was serious enough for me to bitch about to the staff. But this guy hated me literally on sight and was consistently at me for my entire stay. (He wouldn't have seen it that way; interestingly, he was at me in such a way that he tried to make it out to be I was "at" him, i.e."look at what a victim I am". We're talking way, way into playing games-and not even fun ones at that). I never told anyone what he was doing/saying to me, specifically. But I went to 2 different members of the staff (nurse and psych aide) and said something along the lines of "What a crazy-ass asshole" to the psych aide and "This guy is REALLY dangerous" twice to the nurse. As a general rule, because I've worked in healthcare and whatnot, I would not expect them to acknowledge my statement... I mean, 1. Who in the hell do I think I am? Hello, Madame Psych Unit; 2. They do not want to validate my hatred of other patients; it's just not how it all works. BUT, guess what? Both times, staff agreed with me in a highly vitriolic (pretty sure 'vitriolic' is the right word) way; they hated him too. The psych aide called him a pain in the ass; the nurse said, "Believe me, I know he's dangerous" in an emphatic "OMG" way.
The worst thing he did? I'm going to change some details to protect the guilty, but. One small example: he fasted because his way of appreciating a certain famous spiritual hero who shall remain nameless was to try to eat like him, (rice only) and he'd done it until he lost 20 pounds. This is interesting for more than one reason; theres multiple problems with this all by itself. BUT. Then he freaked out over one small thing and went into Rage Mode-nothing significant happened-just something triggered him. In addition to totally flipping out yelling about dumbass shit, and telling everyone what they were gonna do about it and RIGHT NOW (so, big sense of irrational entitlement), he got ahold of his doctor and screamed at him that---(remember, this guy just lost 20 pounds on a self-induced spiritual quest/diet, i.e. HIS OWN DAMN FAULT)---so he gets ahold of his doctor and screams at his doctor not just a little bit but for a good while, right in front of the nursing station, that: "You ARE going to WRITE AN ORDER, RIGHT NOW, I WANT ENSURE AT EVERY MEAL, EVERY MEAL!!! I JUST LOST 20 POUNDS!!! AND I WANT"---short pause to think---"I WANT GRILLED CHEESE AT EVERY MEAL!!!!" He actually stood there and watched the doctor write the order.
So, I just wanted to share. I don't think anyone who thinks they might have narcissistic issues can top it, and I didn't even tell the whole thing.
Incidentally, if anyone can explain any good reason (or any reason) that the doctor didn't get the aides to jump his ass so it could get shot full of a chemical restraint (i.e. let's go beddy-bye, these are the *good* drugs) I'd love to know. Because I think that's what I would have done to him.

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Is it also, "If you're read... (Below threshold)

February 21, 2012 2:40 AM | Posted by DGS: | Reply

Is it also, "If you're reading more of it, it's more you." ?

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and she sounds like she ... (Below threshold)

February 21, 2012 2:53 AM | Posted by adddd: | Reply

and she sounds like she wants some attention all for herself, of her own.

The critic wants to be able to contemplate, to go to therapy and discuss and introspect and what he will do there is talk about himself, think about himself, identify patterns in his life, things that have held him back-- and nothing will change. So then he will tell me that he has "a really good therapist, she really pushes me!"

you are a genius. So then = Excused. correct?

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I don't know if I am happy ... (Below threshold)

February 21, 2012 7:45 PM | Posted by Robert Macoy: | Reply

I don't know if I am happy or sad (uncertain even about that hehe) when as I read this post I identified with the guy in question.

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A Turkish fella in all thes... (Below threshold)

February 21, 2012 10:11 PM | Posted, in reply to Ozgur's comment, by freeman347@hotmail.com: | Reply

A Turkish fella in all these places?

Hit me up bro

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"I'm not dissing HIM. If I ... (Below threshold)

February 21, 2012 10:45 PM | Posted, in reply to Paula's comment, by Anonymous: | Reply

"I'm not dissing HIM. If I were dissing HIM, I'd spell out the douche Bag's name. He withheld information about his STD because he's an evil mofo."-Paula I sympathize, it sounds like you've been through a lot. It does sound like you are dissing him though, but what's wrong with that? This is just a blog on the internet, no major harm done....You might not want to try to see his side of it and I'm not saying you should, but I was wondering if you know that STDs can by asymptomatic. It sounds like there might be a possibility that he didn't know he had one? All of them can be there without a person knowing, all of them are contagious even when a person doesn't have symptoms.

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There are those of us wh... (Below threshold)

February 24, 2012 1:10 PM | Posted, in reply to John's comment, by Reader: | Reply

There are those of us who exist in the "you can be anything" generation, who are smart as hell. And so anything we do feels like "less than our potential" - yeah I've married a beautiful woman, but I could be bangin' supermodels! Yeah I've got a solid career, but I could be a millionaire! Or a doctor! Or a professor!

I was married to that guy. As a wife I was always reminded that there was "better" out there. I felt like a worthless piece of shit. He was miserable, all the time, always chasing the next dream and insisting he was "capable" of doing "more". I fed into it, because in the patriarchy-meets-feminism world of a Traditional American Values gal, you do what your hubby tells you but empower yourself along the way. Masturbation?

Then one day, as a fully-formed adult female, I stopped defining my value as a woman by my ability to fulfill my current male owner's dreams. I wasn't what he needed - I was an enabler and after years of convincing myself I was aiding in meeting his dreams, I came to the conclusion I was assisting him in further self-destruction while destroying myself in the process. And our kids got caught in the cross-fire.

And that's why the original post is not about the girlfriend. She's the smart one. She knows she's not good for him and that they'll be miserable together. All she's lacking is the stones to put her foot down. It has nothing to do with a poor self-image and everything to do with a gut-feeling that their relationship just won't work. Good for her for voicing the feeling at 23, before marriage and kids make the situation even more convoluted.

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This message gave me the ex... (Below threshold)

February 26, 2012 11:33 AM | Posted by randomguy: | Reply

This message gave me the exact punch I wanted. That hurts but I feel I deserved it.
My story is similar but without any girlfriend involved in it.
Starting this day, I am put this on my table and going to work on one thing straight.No more contemplation,introspection etc.
Just hard work.

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It hurts to say this but th... (Below threshold)

March 5, 2012 2:09 AM | Posted by Anonymous: | Reply

It hurts to say this but this sounds a lot like my boyfriend. He has trouble facing reality and endlessly works toward acheiving an elusive goal. I have a strong feeling that he won't be able to achieve it and his lack of focus is taking a toll on our relationship since this has been going on for years now. He's ok with ambivalence and I'm not. I'd like to get engaged/married but with the way his life is going, nothing will happen anytime soon. He's not capable of maintaining a family right now, especially since he hasn't found a stable career (not to mention his professional identity). I think I should break up with him but I'm afraid to. Maybe I lack the guts to do it, but I love him and he's made some gains so far and I don't know if leaving him would be a mistake. Agh. I'm in a dilemma :(

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I had this revelation a few... (Below threshold)

March 13, 2012 11:30 PM | Posted by crumbskull: | Reply

I had this revelation a few years ago and I broke off the relationship, put my foot down and declared "Gosh darn it, I'm going to pick one of the things I am good at and dedicate myself to it." Unfortunately I picked smoking weed...

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Why is this site so overrun... (Below threshold)

March 15, 2012 3:52 PM | Posted by fucked if I know: | Reply

Why is this site so overrun with effing "beta males" and Roissy-ites, it's tragic that I have to sift through that shit to get to the interesting comments.

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There is no dilemma. You al... (Below threshold)

March 17, 2012 7:02 PM | Posted, in reply to Anonymous's comment, by DGS: | Reply

There is no dilemma. You always know what the truth is. How much you want to hide that truth behind all the bullshit you and others put in front of it - that's your deal, and something you must figure out for yourself.

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"I'm not against introspect... (Below threshold)

March 28, 2012 5:34 AM | Posted by Anonymous: | Reply

"I'm not against introspection, I am against masturbation." Yeah right.

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Wonderful article and I am ... (Below threshold)

April 8, 2012 11:57 PM | Posted by buy-mlbjerseys: | Reply

Wonderful article and I am really very helpful thank you

buy mlb jerseys

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Bienvenue à - <a h... (Below threshold)

May 2, 2012 11:46 PM | Posted by tn requin: | Reply


Bienvenue à - http://www.tnstocker.com ----

meilleur sevice de la manière suivante:

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Fraula, could you please ex... (Below threshold)

May 20, 2012 6:49 AM | Posted, in reply to fraula's comment, by treo: | Reply

Fraula, could you please explain how to find and listen to your own feelings more. I don't know where this came from, but I found myself detaching from others and having a hard time emphasizing lately..and I feel like my feelings are buried/scattered. Thank you

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I have many problems in my ... (Below threshold)

May 25, 2012 12:27 PM | Posted by CHARLOT: | Reply

I have many problems in my life and have been to so many spell casters with no results and as a result of this, I ended up in a huge debt. One day I used internet and felt some kind of strange but kind and gentle force as if someone was guiding me to search for spell casters. I can’t remember the words I typed in the search engine but I was directed to vudoospell@gmail.com comments that people has testify. And that was it! I felt so lucky to have found his email. It all happened so naturally and easily and I am glad it did. No words can express the feeling I had. Despite all the bad experiences I had with FAKE spell casters on the internet in the past, nothing could stop me from reaching my dreams, so I ordered a spell from vudoospell@gmail.com.
I had sleepless nights and was was very worried because I promised myself I won’t approach a spell caster for help but did as it was time for me to help myself, stop crying and stop feeling sorry for myself. I also knew there was someone out there who is capable of helping me. I ordered a spell from vudoospell@gmail.com and it took only 1 week for the results to show and it is getting better and better.I have never been so happy. Never ever did I think that I could find a spell caster to help me fix any problems.
my debt are settle with his money spell and also got back my job.

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thank you for the time you ... (Below threshold)

June 3, 2012 1:45 PM | Posted by happy: | Reply

thank you for the time you have given me to help make me a better person and make much more and see much more in my life. I knew I had personal problems. I guess I did not want to see what the truth was about my direction in life and why I was doing certain things. Your insight and genuine ability to be able to see what the real situation is with me is helping me overcome the boundaries I have right now. I know it will not be easy the path I have chosen but at least now I do know what path I want to be on., Thanks to you I know a little bit about myself enough to help me make changes within. Thank- you once again.It really is a big big help to have you in my life and on my side. I will forever be grateful to you ayelalashrine@gmail.comI had already tried three different internet spell caster's services, but all the guys I met were jerks and scams. Then my friend told me about ayelala shrine Spells. I wasn't sure anything would come of it, but I thought, why not take a chance? I cast a Love Spell, and the very next week a gorgeous guy came up to me at a club and asked me to dance. He is caring, kind, romantic - everything I always wanted. We've been together for six months, and we're talking about getting married. I'm a believer!" If you requires any assistance, you can contact him through ayelalashrine@gmail.com

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After the initial co... (Below threshold)

June 11, 2012 7:58 AM | Posted by kiars: | Reply


After the initial contact with Dr. Messiah the freemercytemple@yahoo.com I was still a bit skeptical but he did put my mind at ease

and tell me that he would be there for me no matter what. I have heard this before,so I tested him by calling him different times of

the day and night. He was there for me. I then decided that I would go ahead and order the love boat spell from him. Once I got

everything sent to him he still remained in contact with me and wanted to ensure me that things would be ok. My concern was just

getting my love back. When he cast the spell I started to notice the changes in her similar to the ones that I saw before just in the

reverse. She started coming around and talking with me more and everything just started to fall into place from there which i

could not belief. When she start her bad bevaviour liza our daughter, was getting so out of hand because of all the changes in her

life that I couldn't believe it. When the freemercytemple@yahoo.com started coming back around with his spell casting service

and getting closer to us our family started calming down and returning to normal,i am so happy today the family are happily again

as one. My thanks to Dr. Messiah.

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It was foolish, as I've nev... (Below threshold)

June 11, 2012 11:12 AM | Posted by John: | Reply

It was foolish, as I've never really met her or even spoken with her properly. I was and perhaps am still in love. Now I'm exhausted.

I don't know what happened but I did a lie she saw as decisive for our relationship. What follows is not for me to share, it suffice to say she took revenge and forced my emotions to fit into a new structure. I trusted and deceived her, and she responded with going at great length to demolish that trust so I would have a taste of what she had felt. By means of determined actions, she forced me into seeing her - a kind and sincere person - as something to be afraid of and someone not to be trusted. It was a complete and forced reorganization of my mind. Fair enough, you might say - "an eye for an eye."

She succeeded in some respects. Now I believe she will continue to hurt me until I go away. It's the strangest thing I've ever experienced. She is still the one I met, but now I am to her the one that has to go away. Why don't she simply walk away then, I hear being asked. She is a woman of her word, with a strong sense of integrity, and leaving me would require her to betray herself. To be faithful to her own expressions she can't go, but neither does she want to come closer either. She is not someone guided by emotions as much as convictions.

She's a precious treasure. If you read, and it also goes out to myself, please love more than you love yourself. If you do that, you'll be loved more. Once a poorly understood mystery, now it's more real than seeing my hands. I do not understand what I feel but it's so strong. Going forward will be as walking on air my senses tell me. It's all empty but in the next moment there is no space. There is nowhere to hide and I can't go anywhere.

She'll continue to hurt me and she can, because I believe in her and am not wearing armor. She was looking for gold, but found silver. Too good to throw away, but not enough to enter her heart.

Going forward I'll know she is as pure gold, experience her throwing rocks and my heart will be caught between and moved like a leaf in a storm. There is not much choice.

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Your post does not sound ri... (Below threshold)

June 11, 2012 4:07 PM | Posted, in reply to John's comment, by ginny: | Reply

Your post does not sound right. Look dude- if she's hurting you on purpose, whatever the reason, she's still a bitch. I wouldn't sit around and glorify it. If that's what you like, just got out and find a new girlfriend, I'm sure your needs can be met with someone just as horrible who will, however, stick around and at least be fleshy, or flesh-like.

Men have this nasty tendency to be so surprised when someone hurts them and they feel hurt, surprised, and "real" they then don't know when to say stop. *Say stop*. Say it to her, say it to yourself.

You write as if you were having a religious experience. You're not having a religious experience. Crappy relationships happen every day. Ask anyone.

If you want selfless devotion and commitment to something or someone, look elsewhere. Clearly whatever is or is not going on is *not* helping you. You can do better. Good luck.

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I have just two word... (Below threshold)

August 8, 2012 3:50 PM | Posted by francoise: | Reply


I have just two words in my heart, I want to to thank prophetharry@ymail.com for his wonderful help! . my lover who departed from me last two months came back after 3 days that prophetharry casted a love spell on him, Francoise, Belgium

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if your lover has br... (Below threshold)

August 19, 2012 10:48 AM | Posted, in reply to Guy Fox's comment, by Rosette: | Reply


if your lover has breakup with you then just Do yourself a favor and just email prophetharry@ymail.com and talk with him before you do anything else. You will see results that he can produce. His spell work speaks for itself. An ancient art perfected is how I would describe it! .
I highly recommend prophetharry to you for whatever problems you are experiencing whether is love, money or psychic powers. Rosette, Claremont

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My special Thanks to vudoos... (Below threshold)

August 21, 2012 6:04 PM | Posted by Karj: | Reply

My special Thanks to vudoospell@gmail.com spell caster for all that he did for me. I contacted him on a pregnancy spell, because i have been married for 1year and i have not been able to bear a child, my husband talks to me any howeven thratens on divorcing me. I could not imagine that am living my home and my husband and i ordered a spell from this great spell caster ''vudoo master'' he was now the one that ends all the troubles and fights in my marriage.
He told me never to worry that in 7days after he has cast the spell, if my husband sleeps with me, then i concive.
Just as he directed i did and my marriage shall be a sucess. and now it is because i have given birth to a baby boy who is so fine and kiking,
My husband now loves and treat me like a real wife.
Vudoo spell caster is a my saviour and my everything, anyone with issues should see him.
Many thanks
Karj

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I live in united state, Two... (Below threshold)

September 16, 2012 4:06 AM | Posted, in reply to Guy Fox's comment, by JAMESMOON: | Reply

I live in united state, Two years ago i married a lady called saline, we had two children together, we were very happy to be husband and wife, so when i travel on business trip to Brazil, i spent 1 years in Brazil due to my kind of business, i and my wife talked on phone all the time, we chat on the Internet, i never knew that my wife had started cheating on me by going out with her old school friend called mark, i never knew something was going wrong till i came back from my trip, then i and My wife started having problems, she goes out and come back late at night, she changed in a strange way that i could not endure, i tried to do everything to please her but it got worst, so one day she left the house and never came back, i tried reaching her but no way i could reach her, i never knew she traveled with her new lover which was mark, i wanted her so much because of the children she left for me and because i loved her so much too, because of the heart break she put me into, i went into search of a real magic spell caster I was scammed twice by a spell caster, but I never relented in my search because I want a happy life with my wife, so one morning i saw testimony about a spell caster prophet harry, so i contacted him and to my greatest surprise this prophetharry@ymail.com made life manful for me again, my wife came back to me, i took her back and I am now settled with my wife by the magic power of prophet harry spell .
James moon

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"You make it sound like you... (Below threshold)

October 19, 2012 9:17 PM | Posted by john: | Reply

"You make it sound like your fiancee is suicidal; that you may be the only thing keeping her alive. Most of the Mefites' responses are about her depression. Yet your subtitle is: 'My fiancée is pushing me away and after years trying to make things work, I've lost most of my hope.'"

Umm-hmm...

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After i and my lover... (Below threshold)

November 13, 2012 2:40 PM | Posted, in reply to Wendy's comment, by angelina hocombe: | Reply


After i and my lover spent about 4 years together, my boyfriend told me that we can not be together. and already We were making ready ourselves to get married this year and I was very happy and absolutely ready to marry him. this breakup started when he went a little far from the city where I live, a year before. He found a good job out there. And he promised me to come back in one or two years. In the mean time, I found a job around his place (we take it as a good opportunity for us to start living together) but the company I worked for resist to leave me since i am a responsible person in the company. They offered me a very nice salary increment with huge responsibility of work. Then I told to my boyfriend I preferred to stay where I live and work, since, he has not a plan to live there forever. He was very upset at the moment and ignored me totally. I tried to contact him but I can’t. Following so much effort he sends me a message saying “our relationship is over”. I never expected such a thing to happen, so I got sick. Even after so much begging he allow me to see him, but told me the same thing that it is over. I asked him the real reason. He said, you never listened to me, you never gave me credit, and you disrespected me…..and so on. I never noticed such a thing in our relationship before, so I got shocked and couldn’t say a word in front of him. For me our relationship was perfect. And I really love him. I want to be with him. I send so many letters saying I’m sorry, I tried to contact him but there is no reply. i did everything to attract him and live with him forever but nothing was going through. so I needed a help on how to get my lover back. I had the feelling that he still loves me, though he did not say a word. I needed help seriously. i thought it will never possible to get him back and be the happy couple again? so when i read testimonies about prophetharry@ymail.com i contacted him and he told me that my case is a simple one to solve, so after his consultation and casting of his spell my boyfriend emailed me telling me he was sorry for all that he did to me, that he is ready to marry me now, i was shocked, i never believed that prophetharry could make such thing to happen with his spell, today i am getting married to my boyfriend, and i will never forget this spell caster i will always talk about him anywhere i go
angelina hocombe

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My name is Victoria ... (Below threshold)

December 21, 2012 8:44 AM | Posted by vicky: | Reply


My name is Victoria i am from United States, I was i a relationship with Ben and we loved and cherished ourselves for 3 good years and every thing was going on smoothly but February 14, 2012 a day i can call a lovers day we both had misunderstanding because i answered a call from a guy that is asking me out for a date but i refused,and he told me that the relationship is over and that he is fed up with me and i begged him because i love him so much but he refused me i was so down cast and i felt the world has come to an end for me but my friend told me about a spell caster that helped her sister out in getting her relationship back,a good job and favor in any of her endeavor but at first i was scared but i have to give this man a trial because i love Ben very much and i am not willing to loose him to any woman,so i ordered returning my love spell from this great spell caster that made me a happy woman again to say it all my ex came back to me with much love and a caring heart...i am testifying to this great spell caster Esango Priest. if you need his help you can contact him on esangopriest@gmail.com

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when my husband first leave... (Below threshold)

December 21, 2012 8:51 AM | Posted by roeth: | Reply

when my husband first leave me to fallow another girl, i want to meany spell caster to help cast a spell so that my husband we come back to me,they all made away with my money.until i men a grate caster name prophet osula.when i meant him i told all my problem and he told me that he will cast a spell for me,that after seven days that my husband we be back to me. I did not beloved him because of what other spell caster have don to me, after three days the spell was being cast,my husband that have left me for long call me to tell me that he still love me,that he love to come back to me.EMAIL.ayelalashrine@gmail.com roeth

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I'm reading this because it... (Below threshold)

December 29, 2012 5:01 PM | Posted by asd: | Reply

I'm reading this because it helps me not do anything.

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I tend to do the shit this ... (Below threshold)

January 15, 2013 12:40 PM | Posted by Shamsi Ruhe: | Reply

I tend to do the shit this guy is talking about. Get wrapped up in other people's shit instead of dealing with my own.

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Hello everyone my name is E... (Below threshold)

February 5, 2013 5:51 AM | Posted by Elizabeth: | Reply

Hello everyone my name is Elizabeth,i came across this man called Dr.Ogungbe through a Lady here online and she said he helped her bring back her lost love,i don't believe in this but i come to think about it and use faith and hope to contact this man last 2 weeks,i have lost my husband for 2 years even he is trying to get married to another lady in Italy,Rome..i quickly rush and email dr.Ogungbe for help and i thought its still a freak because i don't really believe he can bring him back to me because its too long we have contacted each other,we only comment on each other status on facebook and when ever he come online he has never talk anything about coming back to me,now i really believe that there is Magic and Dr.Ogungbe is a really God sent and has Magic because all these things is still like a dream to me,Dr.Ogungbe told me in the first mail that everything will be fine,i called him and he assure me,i have so many doubt but now am happy,i can't believe my love broke up with his Italian lady and he is now coming back to me and he can't even explain how everything goes all he said to me is that he want me back,i am really happy and cried so much because it was just like i am born a new and am really happy and my entire family are happy for me but they never know whats the secret behind this...i want you all divorce lady or single mother to please contact this man for help and everything will be fine i really guarantee you..i have tell 2 of my friends who are in unhappy relationship and they have seen solution in few days ago...if you want to contact him you can reach him through (dr.ifaogungbe@live.com) (+2348131210107) that is where you can get to him and i assure you it gonna work fine with you and you will be happy
i am out of words am just happy and i will be happy forever because i can never have any problem having this man
Elizabeth is my name

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My boyfriend of 2 ... (Below threshold)

February 12, 2013 3:18 PM | Posted by jennifer: | Reply

My boyfriend of 2 years just left, no note, no text, no explanation, I was in pieces, I
contacted Prophet Osaze and within a few minutes of talking to him i felt much better, he is so calming, i listened to his advise and he began work for me and it worked within 48 hours and I can't thank him enough.I would just like to say that Prophet Osaze really does do miracles, my soul mate came to quicker than I thought he would. I would recommend him to any-one who needs help, and I will use Prophet Osaze again for further work in the future. You can contact him on spirituallove@hotmail.com

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My name is sharon ... (Below threshold)

February 12, 2013 3:20 PM | Posted by Sharon: | Reply

My name is sharon smith, I am here to testify to the good work of the Dr.Osaze. 2 years ago,

my husband left home, he never returned, no phone calls, no letters, no emails, no sign of

him anywhere. my daughter got sick with multiple sclerosis, things were so tough for me. I

had lost hope, 2 years ago, i met a psychic, he said he would help me, i paid over $6800 and

still nothing happened, i lost hope completely, my daughter's situation got worse each

day.last month, i saw a posting concerning the good works of the wole professionals, i gave

them a try...i paid about $728, for all three spells (Bring Lover back, Healing spell and

Career spells). In a matter of weeks, my husband called me and told me he was sorry and that

he wants to come back to me and that he would explain everything when he comes back, three

days later, i got a new job with an Oil company, right now, my daughter's condition is

getting better each day and i trust she would be well in a matter of days.I want to thank

SPIRITUAL LOVE TEMPLE you can contact them via email:(spirituallove@hotmail.com) for their

efforts and for bringing my life back to normal and so close to perfection.My name is sharon

smith, i live in Canada.PLEASE HELP ME THANK THEM

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lol... (Below threshold)

February 12, 2013 8:20 PM | Posted by Anonymous: | Reply

lol

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This is the best blog post ... (Below threshold)

February 20, 2013 12:23 PM | Posted by Luke: | Reply

This is the best blog post I have ever read. It just has some terrific insight. Everyone should have an article like this written about them at some point in their life.

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Etacon are manufacturers & ... (Below threshold)

February 21, 2013 1:02 PM | Posted by nitin: | Reply

Etacon are manufacturers & suppliers of a wide range of Tensile Structure. We are also engaged in manufacturing of different types of products Like : Awnings , Canopies, Swimming Pool Covers, Car Parking Sheds, Walkways Coverings, Garden Umbrellas etc.

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Thanks once again the grea... (Below threshold)

February 28, 2013 5:26 PM | Posted by Anonymous: | Reply

Thanks once again the great Dr samura I am faith krotov I want to share my testimony to every one here about what this great man did for me I was married for more than six years now know child with this, my heart has been trouble so I don’t know what to do. And I have gone from one place to another still I did not found the solution of my problem on till one day in my office when a friend of mine came for a visit so I have been hiding this for every body not to share this problem to any one so when I see the situation on ground now my husband is about getting another woman, I try my best to share this with a friend so she advise me to contact this great man for a spell cast so I was not my self of telling her my problem so I ask her what we it take me? She said it we not take much time just three days it we be done then I look up and down were we I start from now? She insist for me to try him the I ask her for his contact she gave me his number and his email address his number +2347030410643 and here is the email SAMURATELLERSPELL100@GMAIL.COM so I called him first before I email him to know if his the write person so he cast the spell and am so happy with my husband with two kids with this, the man is great and his spell casting is real thanks to my friend may God almighty bless you all from Nana hill

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Thanks once again the gre... (Below threshold)

February 28, 2013 5:28 PM | Posted by Nana hill: | Reply

Thanks once again the great Dr samura I am faith krotov I want to share my testimony to every one here about what this great man did for me I was married for more than six years now know child with this, my heart has been trouble so I don’t know what to do. And I have gone from one place to another still I did not found the solution of my problem on till one day in my office when a friend of mine came for a visit so I have been hiding this for every body not to share this problem to any one so when I see the situation on ground now my husband is about getting another woman, I try my best to share this with a friend so she advise me to contact this great man for a spell cast so I was not my self of telling her my problem so I ask her what we it take me? She said it we not take much time just three days it we be done then I look up and down were we I start from now? She insist for me to try him the I ask her for his contact she gave me his number and his email address his number +2347030410643 and here is the email SAMURATELLERSPELL100@GMAIL.COM so I called him first before I email him to know if his the write person so he cast the spell and am so happy with my husband with two kids with this, the man is great and his spell casting is real thanks to my friend may God almighty bless you all from Nana hill

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I am Alysia a 27yrs old la... (Below threshold)

March 2, 2013 8:56 AM | Posted by Alysia: | Reply

I am Alysia a 27yrs old lady from Chile. Up until about a month ago I thought I was madly in love .... turn's out the guy just used me got me pregnant and walked out of my life, this is a guy i cannot even lose my eyes if i don't see him, it happen so fast that he is now everything to me. next month I was suppose to meet my parents because i have already told them about him. Things got complicated and i ran out of ideas until i met a friend on Facebook who advised me on how i could get my lover back and everything back to normal. i was given a lady spell cast email address priestessifaa@yahoo.com, i was advice to meet this lady if i ever want to be happy and get my lover back. I contacted this spell lady and she assured me of having him back in 2days, it sounds some how i was even more skeptical when i knew i has to come up with something, but my dear, 3days later my reply to the spell lady was unlimited thanks and happiness for her spell actually worked and brought Jakwel back to me as much as i expected. That spell lady Priestess Ifaa is a goddess. her spell is genuine. Our plans of meet my parents is still on and my baby is growing. I am honestly grateful for the best spell.....If you wanna talk to me, email me at morganalysia@ymail.com
Alysia

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It is important to dress to... (Below threshold)

April 28, 2013 5:09 AM | Posted by Chuck: | Reply

It is important to dress to impress, but comfort also matters. I assumed this person had underlying issues of an emotional nature so I just let it go. It is much easier to have a sincere conversation with an online stranger than it is to talk to a coworker or neighbor.

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I'm embarrassed to say this... (Below threshold)

October 12, 2013 8:24 PM | Posted by Scrambles: | Reply

I'm embarrassed to say this but as I have gotten older I miss having an authority figure to discipline me and and confront me about all the BS tell myself to justify my inertia. I just need to choose one thing and stick to it.

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wtf is this voodoo bullshit... (Below threshold)

October 24, 2013 10:45 PM | Posted by Ralphio: | Reply

wtf is this voodoo bullshit doing here? are you going to brew a potion to cure narcissism?

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Thank you for this post, I ... (Below threshold)

October 26, 2013 1:48 PM | Posted by Cyndi: | Reply

Thank you for this post, I am 4 years out of a relationship that was as close to perfect as I ever expected for my life. I have found myself dealing with the ashes of my relationship and finally after a couple years have moved to a new life.on behalf of masterjames175@gmail.com he have worked very hard on not looking back and having that interfere with the future that I wish to create for myself. But I have not been able to “stop” loving my ex. I really have struggled to find a open unfilled fertile ground for finding love elsewhere. In the past I would have simply never seen her again and freed myself of constant reminders, but we have a child together and its not an option.

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damn thats good. ... (Below threshold)

October 26, 2013 10:25 PM | Posted by Anonymous: | Reply

damn thats good.

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FILTER YOUR FUCKING COMMENT... (Below threshold)

November 22, 2013 5:48 PM | Posted by MOTHERFUCK: | Reply

FILTER YOUR FUCKING COMMENTS GOD DAMNIT.

Tired of getting these assholes in my inbox for the last year!!!

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Hello i am Sharon ca... (Below threshold)

November 28, 2013 1:37 PM | Posted by Sharon caparas: | Reply


Hello i am Sharon caparas ,I am out here to spreed this good news to the entire world on how i got my ex love back.I was going crazy when my love left me for another girl last month,But when i meet a friend that introduce me to priesr grace the great messenger to the oracle that he serve,I narrated my problem to priesr grace about how my ex love left me and also how i needed to get a job in a very big company.He only said to me that i have come to the right place were i will be getting my heart desire without any side effect.He told me what i need to do,After it was been done,In the next 1 days,My love called me on the phone and was saying sorry for living me before now and also in the next one week after my love called me to be pleading for forgiveness,I was called for interview in my desired company were i needed to work as the managing director..I am so happy and overwhelmed that i have to tell this to the entire world to contact Dr priest grace your problem solve..No problem is too big for him to solve..Contact him direct on: Gracerelationshipspell@gmail.com and get your problems solve like me.., he told me what to do and how to do it, after2days Almost two years to the day my husband left, he called me and said he needed to see me immediately. When we met, I could not believe what he had to say. Ameli I'm sorry for all that happen, i never knew what i was doing all this years. i thought i was doing the right thing, buy now, i have learn my lesson and i promise to treat you like a woman and love and cherish you till death. i couldn't believe it.
Trust and believe!
Gracerelationshipspell@gmail.com

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i am shearing out th... (Below threshold)

December 2, 2013 10:21 PM | Posted by ella: | Reply


i am shearing out this testimony, because am so happy about my life i don't have much to say, over a year and 2months my husband left me and my 3months old baby and he went and stay with another woman i try my possible best for him to come back, still yet he refuse, one day i was online on net i saw a testimony of a woman how Dr. Simon, help her it was just like the problems and pains i am passing true in my matrimonial home so i copy the email of Dr. Simon, and email him, and told him about the problems i am passing true in my home, so he promise to help me, i respond to his request because i cant bear the pains any more, so after that Dr. Simon call me and told me that he has true with my work that my husband will call me in the nest 48,ours.i never believe so wen i was in the bathroom, i hard my phone ringing i quickly rush and pick up the phone i saw it was a strange number i pick up the call and i held my husband voice begging me for forgiveness.i don't no how to thanks Dr, Simon because he wipe away all my tears am so happy, if you need his help you can rich him; oksolutemple@outlook.com

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My name is Mrs joy... (Below threshold)

December 9, 2013 6:50 PM | Posted by joyce: | Reply

My name is Mrs joyce from united kingdom i got married at the age of 30 i have only one child and i was living happily .After 5 year of my marriage my husband behavior became so strange and i don't really understand what was going on, he packed out of the house to another woman i love him so much that i never dreams of losing him, i try my possible best to make sure that my husband get back to me but all to no avail i cry seeking for help i discussed it with my best friend and she promise to help me he told me of a man called PRINCE AYAWU, he is a very great man and a real man that can be trusted and there is nothing concerning love issues he cannot do that is why they call him the great doctor. I contacted him And i told him everything that happen all he told me is that i should not worry that all my problems will be solved immediately. He told me what to do to get my husband back and i did, he said after 4 days my husband will come back to me and start begging, it really happen i was very surprise and very happy our relationship was now very tight and we both live happily again.So my advice for you now is to contact this same email address templeofgreatness@gmail.com if you are in any kind of situation concerning love issues and any other things that give you problems contact him.
THANKS..

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My name is Torres I can't e... (Below threshold)

December 10, 2013 8:49 PM | Posted by torres: | Reply

My name is Torres I can't explain this but I just have to share my joy and happiness with the world I don't no how Master magic helped me in bringing back my husband. I have been frustrated for the past 2years with my two kids living without my husband who surprisingly left home with a girl named Kathrine One faithful day a friend of mine came visiting and I told her about the situation I am in for the past two years, she then told me about Master magic. That he is a very powerful man, at first I never wanted to believe her because I have spent a lot going to different places but she convinced me so I had no choice because I really need my husband back. So we contacted Master magic who told me all I needed to do which I doubted. But the greatest joy in me today is that Master magic was able to bring my husband back to me and now we are living happily as never before. Thanks to you Master magic. If you have problems of any kind I will advice you to contact Magicspellhome@hotmail.com you will never regret it. Thanks to Master magic

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My name is Jessica and i a... (Below threshold)

December 14, 2013 3:09 PM | Posted by jessica: | Reply

My name is Jessica and i am from USA. i want to testify of what this great dr. okpoko did for me and my family. i have been married for 3years and there was no child issue. 2 month back my husband started behaving strange, he will stay out late at night and not even come back some times, he will not eat my food and he started having an affair out side with another woman, and he even move in with the woman. until my friend Jane told me about this great dr. who help her got back her lost husband in just 4hours. i contacted the great dr, and he also help me got my husband back to me. I and my family are happily living together. I am even pregnant now. if you want his help, you can contact him on; dr.okpokospellhome@gmail.com

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want to be really honest a... (Below threshold)

January 17, 2014 9:15 AM | Posted by philip: | Reply

want to be really honest about myself and announce to the world about how i was able to get my ex lover back. When my lover left me for another guy i was so down casted to the extend i was thinking of all most killing myself, And as a matter of facts i needed urgent help, So i was seeking for advise from different source both from the internet and from friends around me. And one lucky day for me i came across this great man contact information that saved my life by bringing my lover back to me within the period of 48 hours. Well i know everybody will be wondering who is this great man?, He is nobody else than Dr.kizzekpe and you can easily reach Dr.kizzekpe on this contact information below his mail on; kizzekpespells@outlook.com and i assure you that within the next few hours you will be in greater joy.

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My name is ... (Below threshold)

February 4, 2014 5:25 PM | Posted by Donna Hennas: | Reply


My name is Donna Hennas am from UK. i want to use this opportunity to thank my great doctor who really made my life a pleasurable one today. This great man DR.NICE OKSE brought my husband back to me, i had three lovely kids for my husband, about four years ago i and my husband has been into one quarrel or the other until he finally left me for one lady. i felt my life was over and my kids thought they would never see their father again. i tried to be strong just for the kids but i could not control the pains that torments my heart, my heart was filled with sorrows and pains because i was really in love with my husband. Every day and night i think of him and always wish he would come back to me, until one day i met a good friend of mine that was also in a situation like me but her problem was her ex-boyfriend who she had an unwanted pregnancy for and he refused to take responsibility and dumped her. she told me that mine was a small case and that i should not worry about it at all, so i asked her what was the solution to my problems and she gave me this great man email address. i was doubting if this man was the solution, so i contacted this great man and he told me what to do and i deed them all, he told me to wait for just two day and that my husband will come crawling on his kneels just for forgiveness so i faithfully deed what this great man asked me to do and for sure after two days i heard a knock on the door, in a great surprise i saw him on his kneels and i was speechless, when he saw me, all he did was crying and asking me for forgiveness, from that day, all the pains and sorrows in my heart flew away,since then i and my husband and our lovely kids are happy.that's why i want to say a big thank you to DR.NICE OKSE spiritual temple. This great man made me to understand that there is no problem on earth that has no solution so please if you know that you have this same problem or any problem that is similar, i will advise you to come straight to this great man. you can email him at: professionallovespell@otmail.com

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I AM BELA i want to give th... (Below threshold)

February 9, 2014 6:32 AM | Posted by bella: | Reply

I AM BELA i want to give thanks and i will always give thanks to DR.utimate who brought back my love that has left me for 6years within 48hours, i have said about this last week but i promised to always tell people about this every week end so that those that did not read about it last week will read about it this week, i have been looking for how to get this boy back to my life because i love this boy with the whole of my heart, i could not replace him with any body,one day i was watching my television when i saw a lady giving thanks to DR.utimate and telling the world how he helped her i was so shocked i could not believe it because i never taught that there are powers that can bring back lost love, then that was how i decided to contact him too because i do really need my love back,when i contacted him i told him everything and he told me not to worry that my love will surely be back to my arms within 48hours at first i could not believe because i was thinking how could somebody that has gone for 6years come back within 48 hours,so then i decided to watch and see,unbelievable within the next 48hours i got a call from unknown number so i decided to pick the call the next thing i could hear was my loves voice he was pleading and begging me on the phone that i should forgive him that i should forget all that have happened that he did not know what came over him,he promised not to leave for any reason, that he was really sorry for what he did,i was so surprised because i never believed that this could happen,so that was how i accepted his apology and the next morning he came to my house and still pleading for me to forgive him i told him that everything is okay that i have forgiven him, that was how we started again and now we are married, i promised to say this testimony in radio station, commenting this testimony is still okay but before this month runs out i promise to say this in radio station and i will,sir thank you very much.World please am begging you people to try and thank this man for me,or if you need his help here is his email address:utimatespellhome@gmail.com

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I AM LISA i want to ... (Below threshold)

February 10, 2014 9:40 PM | Posted by lisa: | Reply


I AM LISA i want to give thanks and i will always give thanks to DR.ogboni who brought back my love that has left me for 6years within 48hours, i have said about this last week but i promised to always tell people about this every week end so that those that did not read about it last week will read about it this week, i have been looking for how to get this boy back to my life because i love this boy with the whole of my heart, i could not replace him with any body,one day i was watching my television when i saw a lady giving thanks to DR.ogboni and telling the world how he helped her i was so shocked i could not believe it because i never taught that there are powers that can bring back lost love, then that was how i decided to contact him too because i do really need my love back,when i contacted him i told him everything and he told me not to worry that my love will surely be back to my arms within 48hours at first i could not believe because i was thinking how could somebody that has gone for 6years come back within 48 hours,so then i decided to watch and see,unbelievable within the next 48hours i got a call from unknown number so i decided to pick the call the next thing i could hear was my loves voice he was pleading and begging me on the phone that i should forgive him that i should forget all that have happened that he did not know what came over him,he promised not to leave for any reason, that he was really sorry for what he did,i was so surprised because i never believed that this could happen,so that was how i accepted his apology and the next morning he came to my house and still pleading for me to forgive him i told him that everything is okay that i have forgiven him, that was how we started again and now we are married, i promised to say this testimony in radio station, commenting this testimony is still okay but before this month runs out i promise to say this in radio station and i will,sir thank you very much.World please am begging you people to try and thank this man for me,or if you need his help here is his email address:ogbonispelitemple@hotmail.com


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What happened to me ... (Below threshold)

February 12, 2014 7:25 AM | Posted by Cindy : | Reply


What happened to me is not what i can keep only to myself but to also tell the world so that those that were once like me will get there love ones back and been happy once again. I and my husband had some issues which leads to our break up since after then my life has never been the same i tried all method to get him back but they were just waste of effort and waste of time. But one day during my search on the internet i came across someone testimony about Dr.Zack Balo helped her to get her lover back so i contacted Dr.Zack Balo and to my greatest surprise Dr.Zack Balo was able to bring back my husband within 3 days. With the great thing that happened in my life i decided to tell the whole world about this great man called Dr.Zack Balo. For those in need of Dr.Zack Balo help can contact Dr.Zack Balo via email: wiseindividualspell@gmail.com or better still you can give him a call on +2348078927387. And i promise you that your lover will definitely be back to you.

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I am thanking Dr.Zac... (Below threshold)

February 14, 2014 8:01 AM | Posted by Mellisa: | Reply


I am thanking Dr.Zack Balo for getting my ex boyfriend back to me within 3 days.When my ex boyfriend left me i was so tired and faustrated till i came across Dr.Zack Balo contact whom i contacted and behold i got my ex boyfriend back. If you want to get your lover back contact Dr.Zack Balo via email: wiseindividualspell@gmail.com Dr.Zack the great man that is able to bring back lost love will help you.

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"You're not a good person u... (Below threshold)

February 15, 2014 4:21 AM | Posted by Timor Mortis: | Reply

"You're not a good person until you make good choices. Until then you are chaos. And you know it."

I AM CHAOS!

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I am thanking Dr.Zac... (Below threshold)

February 28, 2014 10:11 AM | Posted by Mellisa : | Reply


I am thanking Dr.Zack Balo for getting my ex boyfriend back to me within 3 days.When my ex boyfriend left me i was so tired and faustrated till i came across Dr.Zack Balo contact whom i contacted and behold i got my ex boyfriend back. If you want to get your lover back contact Dr.Zack Balo via email: wiseindividualspell@gmail.com Dr.Zack the great man that is able to bring back lost love will help you.

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IT IS TIME, FOR ME TO THANK... (Below threshold)

April 24, 2014 10:44 PM | Posted by louis: | Reply

IT IS TIME, FOR ME TO THANKS DR DOVE, FOR RESTORE MY FAMILY. BECAUSE I HAVE MARRIED FOR 7 YEARS LIVING HAPPILY WITH MY WIFE WITH 2KIDS BUT OF RESENT 5MONTHS BACK MY WIFE BEHAVIOR WAS CHANGE FOR BEEN DOING WHAT I DO NOT UNDERSTAND I WAS THINKING ABOUT MY JOB THAT I LOOSE WAS MAKING HER TO BE PA FORMING ALL HER DOINGS SHE PACKED OUT OF MY HOUSE BY SAYING THAT SHE CANT LIVE WITH ME IN THE SAME ROOF. NOT KNOWING THAT THERE WAS A SPIRITUAL PROBLEM CAME UP IN MY FAMILY IT WAS THAT SPIRITUAL PROBLEM MAKE ME TO LOOSE MY JOB AND WANTED TO DESTROY MY FAMILY. ON A VERY FAITHFUL DAY I WAS READING ON INTERNET BLOG AND I SAW A LOT OF TESTIMONY ABOUT DR DOVE ON HOW HE RESTORE FAMILY. AND I TAKE THE EMAIL ON INTERNET AND EMAIL HIM HE ONLY ASK ME FOR MY DETAILS AND MY WIFE DETAILS AFTER THAT HE PROMISE TO BRING ME BACK MY WIFE AND RESTORE MY FAMILY HE ONLY GIVE HIM SELF A WEEK TO WORK OUT ALL HE PROMISE. BEFORE THE WEEK RUNS OUT MY WIFE CAME BACK HOME AND I GOT A GOOD JOB AM VERY HAPPY TODAY THAT DR DOVE RESTORE MY FAMILY NOW I AM LIVING WITH MY WIFE AND WE LOVE EACH OTHER MORE THAN EVER BEFORE. YOU OUT THERE YOU MITE ALSO NEED A HELP OR YOU ARE IN SERIOUS TROUBLE IN YOUR MATRIMONIAL HOME I WILL ADVICE YOU TO EMAIL HIM FOR HELP. HIS EMAIL/ dovesolutiontemple@outlook.com

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*Here is my testimon... (Below threshold)

May 9, 2014 6:57 PM | Posted by mary: | Reply


*Here is my testimony.. I thought it was over for me when my ex left. I
gave all i have for the relationship to work but it was all failure. 4month
after my partner left me for another person, i was introduced to Dr David
and he helped me bring back my ex in 48hrs. Now we are fully married and i
am 2months pregnant. I promised Dr David that i will tell everybody about
him if it works. I am very glad for living a happy life with my love. He
did it for me and i am 100% sure that he will do yours. I am a living
example. you can contact him on (lovespellspiritualtemple@gmail.com

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Hello I am Sophia Andres, I... (Below threshold)

May 12, 2014 11:12 AM | Posted by sophia andres: | Reply

Hello I am Sophia Andres, I am out here to spreed this good news to the entire world on how I got my ex love back.I was going crazy when my love left me for another girl last month, But when i met the website of Dr Ikuku
http://ultimatesolutioncenter.webs.com the great messenger to the oracle that he serve,I narrated my problem to Dr Ikuku about how my ex love left me and also how i needed to get a job in a very big company.He only said to me that i have come to the right place were i will be getting my heart desire without any side effect.He told me what i need to do,After it was been done,In the next 12 hours,My love called me on the phone and was saying sorry for living me before now and also in the next one week after my love called me to be pleading for forgiveness,I was called for an interview in my desired company were i needed to work as the managing director..I am so happy and overwhelmed that i have to tell this to the entire world to contact Dr Ikuku at the following email address and get all your problem solve..No problem is too big for him to solve..Contact him direct on: ultimatesolutioncenter@gmail.com or call him on +2348104181322 and get your problems solved like me..... ONCE AGAIN HIS EMAIL ADDRESS IS: ultimatesolutioncenter@gmail.com or contact him through his website at http://ultimatesolutioncenter.webs.com. he is real and very powerful to help.

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My ex-boyfriend dumped me 2... (Below threshold)

June 26, 2014 12:05 AM | Posted by Rina: | Reply

My ex-boyfriend dumped me 2 year ago after I accused him of seeing someone else and insulting him. I wanted him back in my life but he refused to have any contact with me. So after researching around I found this site and contacted Dr anu. When I had my reading done, I was nervous and scared. I thought he said he wouldn’t be able to help me. But in the end, he told me he could help me to bring him back. I was expecting to have to spend a lot of money because I saw his prices are expensive. So I was really really surprised when he told me all I had to do was to have two candles burned to bring him back. I ordered the candles that Dr anu burns and had him do my candles. He sent me a prayer to say everyday and I did what he told me to do. Two and a half weeks after the last candle finished, my ex was calling me again and came over. He slept over that night and in the morning he asked if we could work it out and get back together, to which I said yes of course! And we have been back together ever since. Thank you Dr anu, you and your Spirits, you are of great help in the community and I think you are the best. I will be back again to have you help me on a situation at my job. Dr anu is really a wonderful, nice, kind and caring person. He really cares about his clients and I would recommend him to any and all who need spiritua help. anuspiritualhome@gmail.com

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My ex-boyfriend dumped me 2... (Below threshold)

June 26, 2014 12:41 AM | Posted by bella: | Reply

My ex-boyfriend dumped me 2 year ago after I accused him of seeing someone else and insulting him. I wanted him back in my life but he refused to have any contact with me. So after researching around I found this site and contacted Dr ativie. When I had my reading done, I was nervous and scared. I thought he said he wouldn’t be able to help me. But in the end, he told me he could help me to bring him back. I was expecting to have to spend a lot of money because I saw his prices are expensive. So I was really really surprised when he told me all I had to do was to have two candles burned to bring him back. I ordered the candles that Dr ativie burns and had him do my candles. He sent me a prayer to say everyday and I did what he told me to do. Two and a half weeks after the last candle finished, my ex was calling me again and came over. He slept over that night and in the morning he asked if we could work it out and get back together, to which I said yes of course! And we have been back together ever since. Thank you Dr ativie, you and your Spirits, you are of great help in the community and I think you are the best. I will be back again to have you help me on a situation at my job. Dr ativie is really a wonderful, nice, kind and caring person. He really cares about his clients and I would recommend him to any and all who need spiritual help. ativiehealingspellhome@gmail.com

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MY HEART IS FULL OF JOY I G... (Below threshold)

July 11, 2014 6:08 PM | Posted by JASMINE: | Reply

MY HEART IS FULL OF JOY I GIVE THANKS TO GOD ALMIGHTY AND DR ANU HE SENT TO MAKE SMILE ON MY FACE. I AM JASMINE FROM U.S COUNTRY I GOT MARRIED FOR 11 YEARS LIVING HAPPILY WITH MY HUSBAND WITH 2KIDS BUT OF RESENT MY HUSBAND BEHAVIOR WAS CHANGE FOR BEEN DOING WHAT I DO NOT UNDERSTAND ALL MY THOUGHT WAS BECAUSE I DON'T HAVE MALE CHILD FOR HIM, WAS MAKING HIM TO BE PERFORMING STRANGE BEHAVIOR HE DROVE ME OUT OF HIS HOUSE SAYING THAT I CAN`T LIVE WITH HIM ANY MORE OVER 6 MONTHS . NOT KNOWING THAT THERE WAS A SPIRITUAL PROBLEM CAME UP IN MY MATRIMONIAL HOME THE SAME SPIRITUAL PROBLEM MAKE ME NOT TO HAVE A MALE CHILD FOR MY HUSBAND AND WANTED TO DESTROY MY FAMILY. ON A VERY FAITHFUL DAY I WAS READING ON BLOGGER AND I SAW A LOT OF TESTIMONY ABOUT DR ANU ON HOW HE WIPE OUT SPIRITUAL PROBLEMS AND RESTORE BROKEN MARRIAGE. AND I COPY THE EMAIL ON INTERNET AND EMAIL HIM HE ONLY ASK ME & MY HUSBAND DETAILS AFTER THAT ALL HE PROMISE WAS, MY HUSBAND WILL CALL ME BACK HOME. 2DAYS AFTER ALL DR SAID CAME TO PASS MY HUSBAND CALL ME BACK HOME WITH SMILING FACE I WAS SO SURPRISE, NOW MY HEART IS FULL OF JOY DR ANU RESTORE MY FAMILY NOW! WILL LOVE EACH OTHER MORE THAN EVER BEFORE. YOU OUT THERE YOU MITE ALSO NEED A HELP OR YOU ARE IN SERIOUS TROUBLE IN YOUR MATRIMONIAL HOME ALSO GET TO CONTACT HIM HIS EMAIL. anuspiritualhome@gmail.com

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I am Kelly from Canada and ... (Below threshold)

August 3, 2014 12:52 AM | Posted by Kelly: | Reply

I am Kelly from Canada and i am so
happy about the help that Prophet Ezuzu
render to me when i helpless. Well let
me give a little introduction about
Prophet Ezuzu. This great man called
Prophet Ezuzu has the power to bring back
lost lover within the period of 48 hours
and you can contact him through these
contact details below:
PHONE NUMBER: +2348052849204
EMAIL: prophetezuzuarenaofsolution@gmail.com
Contact Prophet Ezuzu on those details and
you will be glad you did.

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Today has being the most ha... (Below threshold)

August 3, 2014 10:20 PM | Posted by Anonymous: | Reply

Today has being the most happiest day of my life after 1 year of sadness and sorrow without being with the one i love, i tried all my possible best to make sure i make my lover happy but it never seems to work out well it was like am doing everything in vain but all thanks to Dr OSAUYI for coming to change all my worries and sadness to Joy. i knew the great man when i read some wonderful reviews about Dr OSAUYI how he has helped a lots of people on there relationship problem i was reading a magazine which then i saw great testimonies as well which then i decided not to waste time because i have missed my lover so much i decided to contact him and share all my problem with him which then he told me not to worry that he assures me that within 48 hours everything would be sorted out i believed Dr OSAUYI so much because i believe he can't fail me but truly Dr OSAUYI never failed me a man that stand on his worlds is really a man,my husband who left me for good a year plus replied my text and returned my calls and asked me to please forgive him i was so happy am so grateful to Dr OSAUYI for what he has done for me if you are there pass the same problem or any kinds of problem just contact the great man on OSAUYILOVESPELL@GMAIL.COM or call his mobile number +2348100515075

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hello everyone i am satell... (Below threshold)

August 15, 2014 2:33 AM | Posted by Satella: | Reply

hello everyone i am satella Philip, i am shearing out this testimony to let yu al know all hope is not lost for those who have been cheated by there lovers al i want to say about mine is to tel the wold how i win back my boy friend of 5years who hav no good job for the past 3years and i take him to be mine and do i could to make him happy because i love him so much early last year God was so kind he found a job with the help of a friend of mine called tracy) and i was so happy for him, after 6months that he got a job he definitely change and turn his back on me and i found it difficult for him to take me as his lover as i use to be when he has no job after then i held about him that he always chili out with other girls in different hotels and i was so confuse because this was someone who hav no job for 3years plus i take it to be mine and provide all he needs but now he have a job en making money he forgot all i have done for him, and he spend out his money to other girls outside when i saw that there was no changes and he hav no fillings for me i was looking for advice that relate to my relation ship on internet and saw a lot of advice and testimony on net and i found one that touches my heart was testify on how dr dove bring back her 4years cheating man and i copy dr dove email on the lady testimony and 2days after i email dr about my relationship and dr dove told me not to worry that he will help me out that i should send my lover info to him and i never want to do so because i was scald later on i brief it with my friend and she supported on it that i should send the info to dr dove to give him a try and i send my lover details to dr dove after that dr dove told me what to do and he promise that my lover will surprise me that he have true with my work, `guess what! i was in the bathroom when i had a hone i thought it was a friend of mine when i rushed out i saw my lover with a browned new car when he was out of the car he gave me the key and said this is what he use to apologize for what he has done wrong that i should forgive him and i was very happy and he promise to do a lot for me will are now living together as a golden lovers. dr dove really did a grate work in my life. if your lover is cheating on you and you want to win him or her back contact dr dove his email/ dovesolutiontemple@outlook.com

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Hi everyone, I do hope my p... (Below threshold)

August 20, 2014 5:43 AM | Posted by bridget: | Reply

Hi everyone, I do hope my post gets read and hopefully helps somebody along the line.i will never forget the help priest okpobo temple render to me in my marital life. i have been married for 4 years now and my husband and i love each other very dearly . after 3 years of our marriage my husband suddenly change he was having an affair with a lady outside,i notice it then i was praying for divine intervention the thing became more serious i told my pastor about it we prayed but nothing happen. my husband just came home one day he pick up his things and left me and the kids to his mistress outside at this time i was confuse not knowing what to do again because i have lost my husband and my marriage too. i was just checking my mails in the office when i saw someone sharing her testimony on how priest okpobo temple help her out with her marital problems so i contacted the email of priest okpobo i told him my problem and i was told to be calm that i have come to the right place that i should fill some information concerning my self i did after 30 minus he called me again congratulating me that my problems will be solve within 5days. he told me what went wrong with my husband and how it happen.that they will restored my marriage but i will make a free donation to their Priest home anything my heart told me. to my greatest surprise my husband came to my office begging me on his knees that i should find a place in my heart to forgive him i quickly ask him up that i have forgiven him.friends your case is not too hard why don't you give priest okpobo a try they work surprises because i know they will also bring back your husband. contact him via priestokpobomagictemple131@gmail.com

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I want to share this great... (Below threshold)

August 21, 2014 1:14 AM | Posted by Deb: | Reply

I want to share this great testimony about how Dr.EKPEN TEMPLE helped me bring back my

ex lover, During my search for solution i came in contact with Dr.EKPEN TEMPLE details and

through his help my lover came back to me within 48 hours. So with these i am so bold to

advise anyone seeking for a way to get there lover back to contact Dr.EKPEN TEMPLE at

(+2347050270218) or via email at: (ekpentemple@gmail. com). I am so happy at last myself

and my lover are together again. Thank to Dr.EKPEN TEMPLE once again....

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When I read his original qu... (Below threshold)

October 1, 2014 2:31 AM | Posted by Trixie: | Reply

When I read his original question I intuitively thought "she isn't pushing you away, she just doesn't want to marry you!" and yet couldn't actually pinpoint why I felt that. Your response was perfect and helped me understand why I felt that way towards the man (great advice and insight) and also helped me understand myself and the decisions I make.

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At last my happiness has be... (Below threshold)

October 19, 2014 2:46 AM | Posted by joy: | Reply

At last my happiness has been restored by a Man named Dr ABUBAKAR ,, my name’s are miss JOY i want every one on this site or forum to join me thank this DR ABUBAKAR for what he just did for me and my kids . my story goes like this i was married to my husband for 5 years we were living happily together for this years and not until he traveled to Italy for a business trip where he met this prostitute who be witched he to hate me and the kids and love her only so when my husband came back from the trip he said he does not want to see me and my kids again so he drove us out of the house and he was now going to Italy for to see that other woman. so i and my kids were now so frustrated and i was just staying with my mum and i was not be treating good because my mama got married to another man when after my daddy death so the man she got married to was not treating i and my kids well so i was so confuse and i was searching for a way to get my husband back to me and my kids so one day as i was browsing on my computer i saw a testimony about this MAN DR ABUBAKAR of drabubakarlovespell@gmail.com shared on the internet by a lady and it impress me too so i also think of give it a try at first a was scared by when i think of what me and my kids are passing through so i contact him and he told me to stay calm for just two days that my husband shall be restored to me and to my best surprise i received a call from my husband on the second day asking after the kids and i called Dr ABUBAKAR and he said your problems are solved my child so this was how i get my family back after a long stress of brake up by an evil lady so with all this help from DR ABUBAKAR of drabubakarlovespell@gmail.com i want you all on this forum to join me to say a huge thanks to DR ABUBAKAR and i will also advice for any one in such or similar problems or any kind of problems should also contact him for help

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